- This topic has 11 replies, 5 voices, and was last updated Aug 6-2:34 pm by olsztyn.
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olsztyn
Not of any priority, just curious if other users have similar issue, or it is just me:
– AntiX 19.2 fully updated / IceWM.
– Not giving up on Badwolf (similar issue in the past) made another attempt and installed Badwolf from existing antiX repositories. Version appears still 1.0, (seems outdated). Again, the same test as in the past: Open Youtube and run a video (JS ON). Video starts playing, however after two seconds add counter stops at 2 or 3. AntiX desktop frozen solid. Power button and reboot.
– Downloaded Badwolf 1.1 deb (from Git) and installed, overlaying the antiX version 1.0. Re-tested the same Youtube. Same result – antiX frozen solid. Power button seems the only way.Has anyone experienced similar result or is it just my continued bad luck with Badwolf?
My additional concern is that an app such as this is able to freeze solid a respectable OS? Now, a possibility is it is just IceWM that is frozen and antiX itself is merrily running underneath? I should test with Fluxbox next…
Update:
On Fluxbox the same behavior…
I do not believe a high level app is able to crash the OS as it runs as not privileged, so I am assuming that just desktop is frozen, so:
– How to get out of desktop and prove antiX still merrily runs underneath, just to prove, not that helps in practice…
– In such case (If it is desktop that is so vulnerable) then which desktop would be less prone to crash and survive such test (dwm?)?Just my humble observation, and still not giving up on Badwolf…
Thanks and Regards…- This topic was modified 1 year, 9 months ago by olsztyn.
- This topic was modified 1 year, 9 months ago by olsztyn.
Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_ParametersModdIt
This may not just be a badwolf problem, recently I have experienced total ICE WM freezes using Palemoon,
Librewolf and torbrowser, also freetube youtube player high CPU load and no input possible.Only way out power button and reboot. Running Bullseye fully updated.
Is it perhaps possible that we have a regression, up to now I have seen no new reports on the main buglist
at https://github.com/bbidulock/icewm/issues, a while back there was a bug causing this style of crash.- This reply was modified 1 year, 9 months ago by ModdIt.
This may not just be a badwolf problem, recently I have experienced total ICE WM freezes using Palemoon,
Librewolf and torbrowser, also freetube youtube player high CPU load and no input possible.Only way out power button and reboot. Running Bullseye fully updated.
Thanks for confirming this behavior, happening also with these other web browsers…
In your original post (before you edited) I think I saw additional relevant information but in any case I think looking into IceWM bug reports may not be effective after all, as the same is happening on Fluxbox as well.I think your experiencing these crashes raises priority as per your experience these crashes appear to be more widespread and include some other browsers.
In order to narrow down I will try to test the same condition using some other desktops, such as dwm, which for this purpose will need to re-install to start fresh, and see if it is a weakness of just IceWM and Fluxbox or the actual antiX OS crashing, not handling certain conditions created by these web browsers.Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_ParametersIs it perhaps possible that we have a regression, up to now I have seen no new reports on the main buglist
at https://github.com/bbidulock/icewm/issues, a while back there was a bug causing this style of crash.Thanks again.
My subsequent testing this crash appear to confirm you might be right. Although your search in IceWM bug report did not surface the actual bug/fix, my testing seems to confirm that what crashes/freezes is actually IceWM not the entire antiX OS. So is Fluxbox and JWM…
Test performed to prove this:
– To be more complete, repeated test with Badwolf freezing antiX/IceWM, with using antiX/Fluxbox and antiX/JWM. All of them froze solid running a Youtube video in Badwolf within two-three seconds. I have not found yet a way to get out of this deep freeze except power button.
– Installed fresh dwm, to start fresh but not expecting any better behavior as it is just another WM, is it not?
– In one tag I started Htop, to see memory use and processes
– In the second tag I started Badwolf and proceeded to Youtube to play the same video. This video in the second tag did freeze as quickly as with IceWM, Fluxbox and JWM.
– However, what is the key in this scenario, operation of dwm appears to be functioning just fine. The Htop in the first tag shows dynamically changing processes. I started Chromium in another tag of dwm and I am writing this note. All this without the need for power button to get out of frozen Badwolf!
– This proves antiX OS continues to operate properly and it is the (lame ones) desktops that freeze solid, not the OS itself.
So I think it is a good news for antiX OS (did not crash) and kind of bad news for the mainstream WMs provided with antiX…So my question to experts, considering a recent thread on dwm generating much interest:
How is the architecture of dwm different from other WMs that dwm is not affected by Badwolf crashing and it continues to operate normally as nothing bad happened? No deep freeze or anything… Are tags acting as separate and independent processes and dwm infrastructure sits on top, invulnerable to what happens in individual tags?
This is a great thing to me as in MHO desktop interface should be as reliable as OS itself. What is good if an OS (such as antiX) runs fine underneath when the desktop interface crashes and the only option is to power off the machine?
Here great kudos to dwm…
Just MHO…Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_ParametersJust as a separate note, so it is more visible:
Just by demonstrating by the above testing that dwm seems way superior from the perspective of solid and reliable WM than IceWM/Fluxbox/JWM I do not mean to suggest it should replace any of these.
IceWM, Fluxbox and JWM are much more user friendly so new antiX users find their way about using antiX rather quickly. Running into such desktop freezing issues might be rare and typically should not happen with basic mainstream applications.
However, even if we are not using antiX for any serious, mission critical tasks, a solid OS such as antiX is (as tests prove antiX itself runs fine) deserves a choice of at least one rock solid and reliable desktop interface. From the above simple demonstration neither IceWM nor Fluxbox nor JWM seem to be such ones, if they crash leaving antiX OS hanging dry in the background and requiring power off, which in effect kills all other tasks…Now I am curious if Herbsluftwm is of similarly solid architecture as dwm is… Soon will test…
Thanks and Regards…Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_ParametersAs this problem seems to be rare:
Before I consider this an antiX issue I will start with a freshly downloaded and updated system,
and applications, with and without NVIDIA driver which is not always well behaved.
Should the issue remain further investigate.My system has been in use for months had numerous updates and remasters, is way off from standard antiX.
That applies to both the installed 19.4 and my bullseye runit stick. Will also do some hardware checks
and run on different hardware as a cross check.- This reply was modified 1 year, 9 months ago by ModdIt.
- This reply was modified 1 year, 9 months ago by ModdIt.
andyprough
Just as a separate note, so it is more visible:
Just by demonstrating by the above testing that dwm seems way superior from the perspective of solid and reliable WM than IceWM/Fluxbox/JWM I do not mean to suggest it should replace any of these.
IceWM, Fluxbox and JWM are much more user friendly so new antiX users find their way about using antiX rather quickly. Running into such desktop freezing issues might be rare and typically should not happen with basic mainstream applications.
However, even if we are not using antiX for any serious, mission critical tasks, a solid OS such as antiX is (as tests prove antiX itself runs fine) deserves a choice of at least one rock solid and reliable desktop interface. From the above simple demonstration neither IceWM nor Fluxbox nor JWM seem to be such ones, if they crash leaving antiX OS hanging dry in the background and requiring power off, which in effect kills all other tasks…If you post a link to the video that was crashing for you, I’ll try it on badwolf on DWM on my Devuan box, see if it crashes for me or not.
DWM is definitely not immune to crashing or locking up. It may be that in this particular case DWM is not impacted by the same badwolf/xorg bug in the same way as the other window managers. Which would certainly be useful – crashing the entire system every time you play a video is not a good thing.
anticapitalista
What if you play that video in firefox-esr? Does it crash?
The problem may simply be with the badwolf browser. I’d sooner ditch that than IceWM, fluxbox, jwm.Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.
antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.
Xecure
I missed this thread (not much time this week).
It is definitely badwolf. My initial build without gstreamer1.0-gl dependency made badwolf freeze when trying to interact with all the shitty youtube ads and buttons. But when that package is installed as a dependency, it may sometime cause CPU and RAM to shoot up to the skies.
It is best to NOT watch youtube on badwolf and only use it to browse the web. Use mps or vlc to watch youtube videos.
Should I build badwolf without the gstreamer1.0-gl dependency? It will be offered as recommended anyway, so no need to include it as hard dependency.
This is badwolf. Not antiX.
antiX Live system enthusiast.
General Live Boot Parameters for antiX.The problem may simply be with the badwolf browser. I’d sooner ditch that than IceWM, fluxbox, jwm.
Absolutely. There is no doubt that Badwolf has bugs and this is the one that makes WMs crash.
As I made myself clear in my previous note, all these WMs are user friendly and good enough for typical use. No need to consider replacement of any of these. The fact that under the same testing condition they crashed and dwm continued to function has meaning only for very small ‘market share’, of users that want ultimate reliability. I did not have a chance to test herbstluftwm for this ‘survival skill’.What if you play that video in firefox-esr? Does it crash?
Firefox-esr plays these videos just fine, on the same system. In my experience Firefox is a good backup browser and on another my machine (T60, the only 32bit antiX) Firefox is the only mainstream browser that plays openfm radio/video (http://open.fm) flawlessly, which my wife absolutely requires to be constantly on (low volume) in the kitchen… Even Chromium 32 bit is not able to play this radio/video station correctly. Just Firefox and Palemoon…
Thanks and Regards.
P.S.
If someone means to ask me what exactly Youtube videos I was using to test Badwolf/WMs crashes, these were songs of Turkish singer Hadise, the name of song Prenses, just to listen to beautiful Turkish language… antiX is now Grup Yorum, after all…- This reply was modified 1 year, 9 months ago by olsztyn.
Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_Parametersanticapitalista
Since a ‘normal’ person is unlikely to use badwolf and will stick to the current antiX default browser which doesn’t crash (firefox-esr), I don’t see this as a problem TBH.
Just to let you know that herbstluftwm (my daily wm) didn’t crash even though badwolf did (regularly).Anyhow, thanks for your findings; it shows to me that badwolf is far from being a reliable browser for youtube videos (as Xecure said).
Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.
antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.
Just to let you know that herbstluftwm (my daily wm) didn’t crash even though badwolf did (regularly).
Great to know. Thanks for the info…
Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_Parameters
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