- This topic has 43 replies, 11 voices, and was last updated May 6-1:56 pm by blur13.
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blur13
I agree with PPC about not translating names. I mean, we dont translate the names of the window managers. Icewm is icewm in all languages. Which is a good thing. When someone says they are using icewm we know exactly which window manager they are refering to, regardless of localisation.
Pretty sure coper is supposed to be copper.
marcelocripe
Thank you all for your considerations.
The resource in question is https://gitlab.com/antiX-Linux/desktop-defaults-jwm/-/blob/master/skel/.jwm/themes-list.
If foreign people understand the names of themes in English, I congratulate them. But, me and my countrymen who don’t dominate the English language need the translations of the names of the colors.
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Obrigado a todos por suas considerações.
O recurso em questão é o https://gitlab.com/antiX-Linux/desktop-defaults-jwm/-/blob/master/skel/.jwm/themes-list.
Se as pessoas estrangeiras compreendem os nomes dos temas em Inglês, eu dou os meus parabéns a elas. Mas, eu e os meus conterrâneos que não dominam o idioma Inglês precisam das traduções dos nomes das cores.
PPC
me and my countrymen who don’t dominate the English language need the translations of the names of the colors.
Hi, Marcelo, by now, you know that if I disagree with what you say here, I’ĺl reply here:
– I can’t, of course, tell you not to translate something that’s up for localization, but the logic of what I previouly said is sound. Names of themes can be names of colors, or nothing to do with colors. In JWM’s case, most are just colors, because their creators choose that. But “Coper” is not exacly a color, not, like my IceWM theme FX-dark is a color, but part of the name matches a color. If people want to test a theme, they can test it, even if the name does not imply any color… Like previously stated, when do not translate IceWM by “Gestor de Janela Gelo” in Portuguese, nor JWM by “Gestor de Janelas do Joe”- because they are products, their name is not supposed to be localized, translated.
In Brasil, most people say they use “Windows”, not it’s literal translation “Janelas”, etc, etc… The tiling window manager included in antiX is a German word I can’t even say. I just refer to it as “herbs…”. I know it literally means “autumn air”, but I do not say that I do not use “autumn air” window manager, just because I can’t say the original word…
– Also, the creator of something may want to keep the name of the work unchanged – in my particular case, I do not see any problem with changing a merely descriptive name of a script, like “antiX-updater” translated to “Atualzador do antiX” in Portuguese (I’ve done so myself)… But I would not like anyone changing the theme “FX-dark” to “Efeitos Especiais- Escuro”. I choose that name, I like that name… Maybe the person that created the “Coper” theme liked it to be play on words- it sounds the same, in English as “Copper”, and the title of the window that is in focus is, in fact “copper color”… That word play may be considered a part of the work, and I consider it would be disrespectful to change that…
Pollock used to call his painting numbers – if you called “One” to your master piece, would you like someone to call it “Um”, “uno” “eins”, etc.? Or would you like people to use the name you choose? And if the letters O.N.E. had a special meaning to you? As a creative person, I respect the creative work others do… If I write a book about a woman called “Linda”, I surely would not like someone to translate the title to the English corresponding word “Beautiful”… etc, etc…
– I know this won’t stop your endless battle to translate every single word on antiX, but, at least I used my coffee break to rest a bit, and share, once more, my opinions with you!P.
- This reply was modified 1 week ago by PPC.
Robin
Names of themes can be names of colors, or nothing to do with colors
This is not true at all. These themes are named by the dominating colour used. And the author has purposefully named it by the colour to allow people to know which colour they can expect to get, before using it. So it absolutely makes sense to translate the colours here, otherwise non English speaking people are excluded from immediate understanding. Which non native English speaker would associate crimson, emerald or periwinkle with the proper colours? But actually this is the task of these names when you see them in Menu: As a user you should be able to intuitively understand what’s the gist of it. And this works only for non native English speakers if all the crude English phrases get translated regardless whether you call them „names” or not.
Or would you like people to use the name you choose?
Simply answer: No. I wouldn’t expect them to use tongue twisters like HerbstluftWM, which is a funny construct already, since it is half German and half English. In German it would read HerbstluftFv, meaning Herbstluft Fensterverwaltung. I think People speaking other tongues should not hesitate to translate it to whatever they feel like to make it speakable in their tongue. If it’s about not translating Names, I disagree. I’m perfectly fine other languages call „Deutschland” e.g. „Germany” or „Allemangne”, or use „Munich” for the name of the City „München” and „Cologne” for „Köln”. So we should not hesitate to use translated names we can pronounce easily for simple things like programs without any concerns.
Same is valid for my “laufweite” tool. The single reason not naming it in English language was for me the ambiguity of the equivalent English typographic term: „tracking”. Tracking stands for me as a symbol of spying and breaking your privacy, while laufweite actually only calculates the absolute length in pixel of a string printed with a given font in a given size. I wonder, what people would guess when I had actually called it „tracking“ 🙂 But feel free to translate its name anyway.- This reply was modified 1 week ago by Robin. Reason: remembered call names has a special meaning in English language
Windows is like a submarine. Open a window and serious problems will start.
Brian Masinick
me and my countrymen who don’t dominate the English language need the translations of the names of the colors.
Hi, Marcelo, by now, you know that if I disagree with what you say here, I’ĺl reply here:
– I can’t, of course, tell you not to translate something that’s up for localization, but the logic of what I previouly said is sound. Names of themes can be names of colors, or nothing to do with colors. In JWM’s case, most are just colors, because their creators choose that. But “Coper” is not exacly a color, not, like my IceWM theme FX-dark is a color, but part of the name matches a color. If people want to test a theme, they can test it, even if the name does not imply any color… Like previously stated, when do not translate IceWM by “Gestor de Janela Gelo” in Portuguese, nor JWM by “Gestor de Janelas do Joe”- because they are products, their name is not supposed to be localized, translated.
In Brasil, most people say they use “Windows”, not it’s literal translation “Janelas”, etc, etc… The tiling window manager included in antiX is a German word I can’t even say. I just refer to it as “herbs…”. I know it literally means “autumn air”, but I do not say that I do not use “autumn air” window manager, just because I can’t say the original word…
– Also, the creator of something may want to keep the name of the work unchanged – in my particular case, I do not see any problem with changing a merely descriptive name of a script, like “antiX-updater” translated to “Atualzador do antiX” in Portuguese (I’ve done so myself)… But I would not like anyone changing the theme “FX-dark” to “Efeitos Especiais- Escuro”. I choose that name, I like that name… Maybe the person that created the “Coper” theme liked it to be play on words- it sounds the same, in English as “Copper”, and the title of the window that is in focus is, in fact “copper color”… That word play may be considered a part of the work, and I consider it would be disrespectful to change that…
Pollock used to call his painting numbers – if you called “One” to your master piece, would you like someone to call it “Um”, “uno” “eins”, etc.? Or would you like people to use the name you choose? And if the letters O.N.E. had a special meaning to you? As a creative person, I respect the creative work others do… If I write a book about a woman called “Linda”, I surely would not like someone to translate the title to the English corresponding word “Beautiful”… etc, etc…
– I know this won’t stop your endless battle to translate every single word on antiX, but, at least I used my coffee break to rest a bit, and share, once more, my opinions with you!P.
Well said @PPC!
I admire the enthusiasm of Marcelo to localize and translate every possible thing so that fellow Brazilian Portuguese speaking friends can use and understand it. We all appreciate this. Your point about attempting to translate EVERYTHING is also good – some things are simply not intended to be translated.
I don’t know if we’ve had anyone provide any specific guidelines on what should or should not be translated. I’ve not been close enough to this action to explain or isolate which string should or should not be translated. This is something that should be tightened up by the leads in this particular area of development work.
I wish I had more direct, current knowledge. I was a localization expert but my expertise is twenty five years out of date and I no longer remember any of the fine points needed, plus my expertise was on a specific commercial UNIX implementation, NOT a 21st century Linux distribution.
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Brian Masinickblur13
Good luck using a map with street names translated…
Sometimes its helpful for everyone to refer to an object by the same name.
As a creative person, I respect the creative work others do… If I write a book about a woman called “Linda”, I surely would not like someone to translate the title to the English corresponding word “Beautiful”
Most Books translated from foreign languages I know have translated titles, and even protagonist’s names have been changed in translation, otherwise unreadable for not native speakers of the source language (think of Russian for example). You should differentiate between names being only names (e.g. of people), and product names that give additional hints about usage or characteristics a user should be aware of (like blue theme etc.)
Btw, translation of Books is a highly creative and artistic task on its own; I’ll remind you of the words of the famous translator Alexander Nitzberg: „What good is it if I translate literally and then need a footnote because I have to explain it to the reader? He should understand spontaneously. By being literal, you only do a favour to full-blooded philologists and literalists.” Translation doesn’t mean simply to copy words 1:1 from one language to another. You will have to transport the gist, the core, the idea, the feeling, the tune, not the words. Once you’ve understood this essential basics of really good translation, you won’t complain about changed words or names any longer. Translating it this way means highest respect for the work of the original author.using a map with street names translated
Not the very best example. In modern printed maps you’ll have to look for translated Objects already, like „Frankfurt Airport” instead of „Flughafen Frankfurt”, same for signs reading „City Center” nowadays instead of „Stadtzentrum”. So these maps have been translated already, at least partially. But in the other direction 🙂
Sometimes its helpful for everyone to refer to an object by the same name.
True in some specific cases. But people need to understand on first sight what it’s all about in a menu. You can give the original untranslated name as an addition, but not as the primary entry meant for people to understand immediately when opening the menu first time. We live in a century not only skilled computer experts, well trained in programming languages and English language and the special English PC terminology, do use computers. The days have gone when everything needs to run in English language on a PC.
If you follow your „everyone to refer to an object by the same name” paradigm, you should never translate any program at all, so people refer to the very same objects when describing some clicks in program submenus or dialogs… You’ll understand yourself that this approach doesn’t fit and can’t work for everyday usage of PCs for people in foreign languages. It simply needs to be translated, regardless of whether English speaking people can understand it still then or not, or whether they still know easily which object it’s about.Windows is like a submarine. Open a window and serious problems will start.
marcelocripe
First of all, I need to remind everyone here what the title of this thread is “Can we have a thread on here for words that are troublesome?” which was started by Linuxdaddy. I just don’t know why the name of “Linuxdaddy” is displayed as “Anonymous”.
I will not quote any of the texts and considerations that I have read in this thread. But for clarification purposes to calm some people’s nerves and concerns, I will make a few more considerations here on the same subject that I have dealt with several times here in this forum and in other forums.
When a Brazilian starts antiX 21 or 22 and navigates through the Applications submenu, he will find most of the texts contained in the line “Name[pt_BR]=XYZ”, where “XYZ” is the text in my language. When the entry “Name[pt_BR]=XYZ” does not exist, the text of the entry “Name[pt]=XYZ” should be displayed, but this does not happen in antiX, the text contained in the entry “Name=XYZ” is now displayed ” which is normally in English language.
Well then, what or how do you expect a Brazilian to know what “zzzFM”, “Rox-Flier”, “SearchMonkey”, “CherryTree”, “Firefox” and so many others are used for which, when translated, are reasons for jokes in my language. Due to the name being totally insignificant to the program itself, here in Brazil we do it this way:Name[pt_BR]=Gerenciador de Arquivos zzzFM
Name[pt_BR]=Gerenciador de Arquivos Rox-Flier
Name[pt_BR]=Pesquisar Arquivos e Pastas com o SearchMonkey
Name[pt_BR]=Organizador de Notas CherryTree
Name[pt_BR]=Navegador de Internet Firefox ESRIf you’re not a native, if you don’t live among the people here and you don’t know how difficult it is to learn technology due to the “soup” of words that exist in another language, then it means that you don’t understand the main difficulty of Brazilians, which is the huge amount of untranslated words in operating systems. I’ve been working since August 2020 to try to minimize the problem called “communication”. As much as Microsoft has done very poorly done translations and in many cases it has not translated several words, such as the “Downloads” folder, even so, there are still many texts similar to the model I wrote above. If you are curious to analyze my translations, feel free, access the /usr/share/applications/ and /usr/share/applications/antix folder and open them with Geany or with Leafpad (you know that both are “text editors”) “), so you can see that I don’t translate the names of the programs and when I do the translation/adaptation to “pt_BR”, I quote somewhere the original name of the program, which could be in the Help text, in the entry text “Comment[pt_BR]=” or in the title bar of the window, as I did in the AppSelect program.
In the case of the JWM theme list, they are color names (at least, that’s what I get in the automatic translation), in the text there is only one word “coper” which the automatic translation did not give any indication of what the meaning refers to the appearance of something or something. I figured it might be a typo, but as I’m not a native speaker and don’t have any ownership of the English language, I came back to this thread to ask for help. As there are typos scattered in the program, in my texts and in other people’s texts. Could this be the case and if it is a typo it has been present in antiX for a long time.
Put yourself in the shoes of instructors, advisors and IT professors. Should they teach the English language or should they teach how to operate the computer with an operating system?
The main objective of my long volunteer work of translating antiX and MX linux is to ensure that communication is complete, or that communication is the best possible, or that communication is the best I can do with my ability to understand . Not too long ago, it was on the 27th of October 2020 that I posted this topic Suggestions to make antiX Linux more educational“. Know that the words “didactic” and “educational” have different meanings and values in my language. Does this topic manage to clarify and reduce your concern?
They don’t want that on a planet where many people are still hungry, where most people are illiterate, they have to learn the English language and still understand that “The monkey is used to search files and folders” (Is this for laughing or is it for crying ? Or is it some kind of joke?)
Before making further comments about translating or not translating, please read these articles with the help of an automatic translator.
How to reduce digital illiteracy in Brazil?
The issue of digital illiteracy in Brazil
Several controls of various equipment were not translated the texts of the keys, among them, the control of an air conditioner of a famous brand. A refrigeration technician had to explain over the phone to a client that the client would have to press the “cool” button to cool the room, as she complained that the air conditioning was not working. The phone call was recorded and has been circulating on social media here in Brazil for many years. For people who know what the word “cool” means it’s a joke, but for most people it’s not a joke, it’s an insult. As the word “cool” in English is similar in pronunciation to the offensive and profanity word “cú” in Portuguese, the customer heard the technician tell her several times “squeeze your ass”, or “squeeze your ass”, or ” press the ass button”, “put it in the ass”. The customer started cursing the refrigeration technician because she doesn’t understand the English language and still believed she was being offended. The translation of “cú” is “ass”. Therefore, why should we not translate?
I sincerely apologize to all of you for using the above example of how lack of translation causes many conflicts and miscommunications between people.
They carried out a survey in the major capitals of Brazil, asked the following question to people walking on the sidewalks “What do you think of WiFi? Do you agree with the use of WiFi? Do you use WiFi?”. Several people replied that “WiFi is a ‘bad thing'”, “WiFi is a devil’s thing”, “WiFi is wrong and should not be used in any way”, and from there to worse… If they If the questions had been asked with the translation “What do you think about the wireless network? Do you agree with the use of the wireless network? Do you use the wireless network?”, they would certainly not have been against a technology that people use without knowing it very well what it is or what it is for. The result of this research served to prove to a manufacturer that its product has to be translated to be successful here in Brazil and that only with translations will people be able to understand it and be able to use it.
And finally, do you know why there aren’t several Brazilians repeating the same basic questions about antiX several times here on the forum? The answer is: Because we organize ourselves into various groups on WhatsApp, Telegram and other social networks to welcome newcomers. We try to help each other with the knowledge we have and when we can’t solve problems by ourselves, I’m the first to ask people to post their doubts or difficulties here on the forum, because this is where the antiX specialists are.
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Antes de mais nada, eu preciso lembrar a todos aqui qual é o título deste tópico “Can we have a thread on here for words that are troublesome?” que foi iniciado pelo Linuxdaddy. Eu só não sei por qual motivo o nome do “Linuxdaddy” é exibido como “Anonymous”.
Eu não irei citar nenhum dos textos e as considerações que eu li neste tópico. Mas para efeito de esclarecimentos para acalmar alguns ânimos e as preocupações de algumas pessoas, eu irei fazer mais algumas considerações aqui sobre o mesmo assunto que eu tratei várias vezes aqui neste fórum e em outros fóruns.
Quando um Brasileiro inicia o antiX 21 ou 22 e navega pelo submenu Aplicativos e irá encontrar a maioria dos textos contidos na linha “Name[pt_BR]=XYZ”, onde “XYZ” é o texto em meu idioma. Quando não há a entrada “Name[pt_BR]=XYZ”, deveria ser exibido o texto da entrada “Name[pt]=XYZ”, mas isso não acontece no antiX, passando a ser exibido o texto contido na entrada “Name=XYZ” que normalmente está em idioma Inglês.
Pois bem, o quê ou como vocês esperam que um Brasileiro saiba para que serve “zzzFM”, “Rox-Flier”, “SearchMonkey”, “CherryTree”, “Firefox” e tanto outros que ao serem traduzidos são motivos de piada em meu idioma. Devido ao nome ser totalmente insignificante ao programa em si, nós aqui no Brasil fazemos desta forma:Name[pt_BR]=Gerenciador de Arquivos zzzFM
Name[pt_BR]=Gerenciador de Arquivos Rox-Flier
Name[pt_BR]=Pesquisar Arquivos e Pastas com o SearchMonkey
Name[pt_BR]=Organizador de Notas CherryTree
Name[pt_BR]=Navegador de Internet Firefox ESRSe você não é um nativo, não convive entre as pessoas daqui e também não sabe o quão difícil é para aprender tecnologia devido a “sopa” de palavras que existem em outro idioma, então significa que você não compreende a principal dificuldade do Brasileiros, que é a quantidade enorme de palavras não traduzidas nos sistemas operacionais. Eu estou trabalhando desde agosto de 2020 para tentar minimizar o problema chamado “comunicação”. Por mais que a Microsoft tenha feito traduções muito mal feitas e em muitos casos não traduziu várias palavras, como a pasta “Downloads”, mesmo assim, ainda tem muitos textos semelhantes ao modelo que eu escrevi acima. Se vocês estiverem curiosos para analisarem as minhas traduções, fiquem à vontade, acessem a pasta /usr/share/applications/ e /usr/share/applications/antix e abram como Geany ou com Leafpad (vocês sabem que ambos são “editores de textos”), assim vocês poderão ver que eu não traduzo os nome dos programas e quando eu faço a tradução/adaptação para “pt_BR”, eu cito em algum lugar o nome original do programa, podendo ser no texto de Ajuda, no texto da entrada “Comment[pt_BR]=” ou na barra de título da janela, como eu fiz no programa AppSelect.
No caso da lista de temas do JWM, são nomes das cores (ao menos, é isso que eu obtenho na tradução automática), no texto tem apenas uma palavra “coper” que a tradução automática não deu nenhum indicativo de que o significado se refere a aparência de algo ou alguma coisa. Eu imaginei que poderia ser um erro de digitação, mas como eu não sou um nativo do idioma e não tenho propriedade alguma sobre o idioma Inglês, eu voltei neste tópico para pedir ajuda. Como existem erros de digitação espalhados nos programa, nos meus textos e nos textos de outras pessoas. Poderia ser este o caso e se for um erro de digitação, ele está presente no antiX há muito tempo.
Coloquem-se no lugar dos instrutores, orientadores e professores de informática. Eles devem ensinar o idioma Inglês ou devem ensinar a operar o computador com um sistema operacional?
O meu longo trabalho voluntário de tradução do antiX e do MX linux tem como principal objetivo garantir que a comunicação seja plena, ou que a comunicação seja a melhor possível, ou que a comunicação seja o melhor que eu conseguir fazer com a minha capacidade de compreensão. Não faz muito tempo, foi no dia 27 de outubro de 2020 que eu postei este tópico “Suggestions to make antiX Linux more educational“. Saibam que as palavras “didático” e “educacional” possuem significados e valores diferentes no meu idioma. Será que este tópico consegue esclarecer e diminuir a preocupação de vocês?
Não queiram que em um planeta onde a muitas pessoas ainda passam fome, onde a maioria das pessoas são analfabetas tenham que aprender o idioma Inglês e ainda compreenderem que “O macaco serve para pesquisar arquivos e pastas” (Isso é para rir ou é para chorar? Ou é algum tipo de piada?)
Antes de fazerem novos comentários a respeito de traduzir ou não traduzir, por favor, leiam estas matérias com a ajuda de um tradutor automático.
Como reduzir o analfabetismo digital no Brasil?
A questão do analfabetismo digital no Brasil
Diversos controles de vários equipamentos não foram traduzidos os textos das teclas, entre eles, o controle de um ar condicionado de uma marca famosa. Um técnico em refrigeração precisou explicar por telefone a uma cliente que a cliente teria que apertar o botão “cool” para resfriar o ambiente, pois ela reclamava que o ar condicionado não estava funcionando. A chamada telefônica foi gravada e faz muitos anos que circula pelas redes sociais daqui do Brasil. Para as pessoas que sabem o que a palavra “cool” significa é motivo piada, mas para a maioria das pessoas isso não é uma piada, é uma ofensa. Como a palavra “cool” em Inglês possui a pronuncia similar a palavra ofensiva e de baixo calão “cú” em Português, a cliente ouviu o técnico falar para ela várias vezes “aperta no cú”, ou “aperta o cú”, ou “aperta o botão cú”, “põe no cú”. A cliente começou a xingar o técnico em refrigeração porque ela não compreende o idioma Inglês e ainda acreditou estar sendo ofendida. A tradução de “cú” é “ass”. Por tanto, por qual motivo não devemos traduzir?
Eu peço desculpas sinceras a todos vocês por eu utilizar o exemplo acima de como a falta de tradução causam diversos conflitos e falhas na comunicação entre as pessoas.
Fizeram uma pesquisa nas grandes capitais do Brasil, faziam a seguinte pergunta para as pessoas que transitavam nas calçadas “O que você acha do WiFi? Você concorda com o uso do WiFi? Você usa do WiFi?”. Várias pessoas responderam que “O WiFi é coisa do ‘coisa ruim'”, “O WiFi é coisa do capeta”, “O WiFi é errado e não deve ser utilizado de forma alguma”, e daí para pior… Se as mesmas perguntas tivessem sido feitas com a tradução “O que você acha da rede sem fio? Você concorda com o uso da rede sem fio? Você usa a rede sem fio?”, certamente não teriam sido contra a uma tecnologia que as pessoas utilizam sem saber muito bem o que é ou para que serve. O resultado desta pesquisa serviu para provar a um fabricante que o seu produto tem que ser traduzido para obter sucesso aqui no Brasil e que só com as traduções as pessoas poderão compreendê-lo e irão conseguir utilizá-lo.
E para finalizar, vocês sabem por que não tem vários Brasileiros repetindo diversas vezes as mesmas perguntas básicas sobre o antiX aqui no fórum? A resposta é: Porque nós nos organizamos em vários grupos de WhatsApp, Telegram e em outras redes sociais para receber os novatos. Nós tentamos nos ajudar com o conhecimento que possuímos e quando não temos como resolver sozinhos os problemas, eu sou o primeiro a pedir para a pessoa postar a sua dúvida ou dificuldade aqui no fórum, pois é aqui onde estão os especialistas do antiX.
Brian Masinick
“I just don’t know why the name of “Linuxdaddy” is displayed as “Anonymous”.
Linuxdaddy chose to leave this forum. One of the days when I was unavailable to moderate,
the unpleasant people were out there insulting helpful people like Linuxdaddy.
He had enough and resigned from the forum. That’s why the name is now Anonymous.--
Brian MasinickBrian Masinick
Regarding the use of the animal name monkey, I can think of two completely different applications that use monkey as a part of their name.
One that I know best is Seamonkey, so it’s not literally a monkey, it’s a sea monkey. The tool is a Mozilla-based Web browser that dates back to the beginning of the current millennium. The second app is SearchMonkey; I haven’t used it much, if ever, but from the context of the name it’s a search tool. Looking it up, I find that it is a “Powerful desktop search app for Windows, Linux and Mac. Power searching on your desktop without the pain.”--
Brian MasinickBrian Masinick
Regarding the use of acronyms, I completely agree. If we state that a wireless network is sometimes called a WiFi or WiFi network, that helps.
Acronyms and abbreviations are important because it’s difficult to repeatedly write out long words or phrases, but it’s also important to explain them prior to repeated use; that’s proper writing style whether the words are translated or not.Another thing: the first time we mention various applications, it’s nice to actually say what the application does and what it is used for. Some applications are very popular and it may seem that their use and understanding is common knowledge; that is a false assumption. Every technology user has to start at the beginning. When the beginner has to hunt far and wide to figure out what something does and why it’s used, that is daunting when there are hundreds, perhaps thousands of apps, terms, techniques and so forth that have to be learned. That’s enough by itself; when the reader has to hunt for hours or days to find out basic information, for many it’s too much; no wonder so many people avoid some great technology. The reason is that it’s REALLY difficult to learn without an extensive background.
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Brian Masinickmarcelocripe
Did you manage to read the two articles that superficially portray the sad reality we live here in Brazil?
Faced with our sad reality, I was surprised when I found out that Synaptic was created by a Brazilian named Alfredo Kojima. If he had written “Sináptico” in “pt_BR” you wouldn’t have been able to write the accent on the letter “a”, since in the English language this type of accent doesn’t exist, right?If it’s not correct to translate the names, then why is the name of my country “Brasil” in English written with the letter “z”?
de=Deutschland
en=Germany
pt=Alemanha
pt_BR=AlemanhaIf it is not correct to translate the names, then who translated first, English speakers or Portuguese speakers? If it is not correct to translate the names, everyone should write “Deutschland”and “Brasil”.
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O senhor conseguiu ler as duas matérias que retratam de forma superficial a trista realidade que vivemos aqui no Brasil?
Diante da nossa triste realidade, eu fiquei surpreso quando descobri que o Synaptic foi criado pelo brasileiro chamado Alfredo Kojima. Se ele tivesse escrito “Sináptico” em “pt_BR” vocês não teriam como escrever o acento na letra “a”, já que no idioma Inglês não existe este tipo de acentuação, não é mesmo?Se não é correto traduzir os nomes, então porque o nome do meu país “Brasil” em Inglês é escrito com a letra “z”?
de=Deutschland
en=Germany
pt=Alemanha
pt_BR=AlemanhaSe não é correto traduzir os nomes, então quem traduziu primeiro, foram os falantes do Inglês ou foram os falantes do Português? Se não é correto traduzir os nomes, todos deveriam escrever “Deutschland” e “Brasil”.
@Marcelo
Now you are just being hard headed, my friend. I told you several times:
Names of countries, cities, or Nobility are supposed to be translated. Sometimes many languages simply keep the original native name, others, they create it’s “translated” version. Examples:
– King Charles III, in pt and pt-br is called “Rei Carlos III”
– but you, Marcelo, are always called “Marcelo”, and not “Marcel” in English
– Portugal is spelled the same in Portuguese and English, but Brazil is not…
– Names of Products (like Linux, Windows, MacOS, etc) are not translatable. Like I said, you do not translate the name of the OS “Windows” to “Janelas” in pt-bt…One good reason for not translating names, it’s because, like Robin said, trasnlating implies adapting the original text, an no translators translate all expressions the same way.
You localized antixscreenshot2’s command line options, right?
Now imagine that every single command line option in Linux got translated- if I told someone to
sudo apt update && sudo apt upgrade
if all that was translated to Portuguese it would make no sense, beveuae “update” and “upgrade” in our language are translated by “atualizar”, so using a fully localized command line would result in:
sudo apt atualizar && sudo apt atualizarIt would also make it almost impossible to follow on-line instructions to use the terminal, since they would all have to be in portuguese, using the exact same localization that you used (and debian may use a different translator that antix uses for that, etc)
(I’m oversimplifying, but I hope you get the point)
This should be my last post for a couple of days…P.
You localized antixscreenshot2’s command line options, right?
Yes, and on purpose. It makes using the command line options possible to people not speaking English language, while it doesn’t keep other people in international conversation from being concise: Please keep in mind, only the long forms of command line options like –help are to be translated, not the short forms like -h. So you can always refer to the short forms when talking in an international context, no need at all to use the very same localisation (while you may additionally mention the long form as you see it in your language).
Windows is like a submarine. Open a window and serious problems will start.
RJP
$ sudo apt päivitä && sudo apt asenna päivitykset E: Virheellinen toiminto päivitä
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