Consequences of browsing on old equipment

[Moderator Brian Masinick]

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Yeah but I haven’t gotten my hands on anything really old AND good in quite a while. My brother in law was gonna send a Thinkpad X201 to a recycling center or a dump; I asked him to let me have it instead; it’s my best old system in years.

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Brian Masinick

[Member seaken64]

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My last good find was an old Tandy 1000HD from 1984. It was buried in a bunch of trash under the stairs on a remodel where I was installing a fireplace this last summer. The owner gave it to me. Pretty cool. I only wish I could find an original IBM 5150 that easy. My oldest business style PC is an Northstar Advantage (running CP/M).

Seaken64

[Member DaveW]

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So, what suggestions would you have for replacing a Dell 620?

I’m actually very happy with this unit… except, lately, it occasionally freezes, at seemingly random times (during boot-up, on opening email program, on accessing email, while browsing internet, while reading something with no key entry…), with various display anomalies (sometimes a small square with colored stripes appears at a random location, sometimes there are vertical or horizontal bars, sometimes there is a mad scramble on the screen, sometimes the cursor just freezes and Conky shows no time movement). These things can happen at any time. But sometimes, the unit runs all day, flawlessly. Most of the above has been observed with AntiX 17 (32 bit). But I have already experienced a couple of similar freezes with a recent experimental install of AntiX 21 (32 bit). Both use 4.9.0-xxx kernel. I don’t run anything that approaches RAM limits.

Anyway, I’m assuming there is something flaky in the D620, since these symptoms don’t appear on my Asus eeepc or Asus K54.

[Moderator Brian Masinick]

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@DaveW: not positive but it could be a sign of impending hardware failure; I saw that on an old unit before…

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Brian Masinick

[Moderator Brian Masinick]

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I love Thinkpad models. If you see one for a decent price, snag it.

Best laptop keyboard; solid construction. Tend to be expensive but one like the Thinkpad X201 would be a great replacement for the D620.

I had a 17″ Gateway 2000 that gave me surprisingly good service too but the Thinkpad is even better.

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Brian Masinick

[Member ModdIt]

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Hi DaveW,
Should you use any chrome based browser deactivate hardware acceleration. It causes weirdest freezes. I guess you already tried a
different kernel.

On top:
please post your dell model and revision plus processor. Might be a known fixable problem. Could also, if you are on a Latitude check
cooling system and replace BIOS battery, if you are happy with the job replace the thermal paste on chips. To make that easier warm
the cooling system with a hairdryer, do not use much force, if sticking tight warm up to about 6oC, that is uncomfortable to touch for
long but system safe. If you use a hot air gun without exact temperature controll keep it well away from board or you could end up blowing
components away from position.

On thinkpads, I really like them, unfortunately Lenovo has removed many from parts support. Should you get a T series capton tape the
chassis and bottom of keyboard where the cable runs, that was an official mod to prevent the thin insulation on the cable rubbing through
and shorting. Check cooling system is clean at same time, give it a fresh bios battery.
Very hard to get a good replacement keyboard here in EU.
T410 420 430 are very solidly built, later models still robust but not as much so. Core I5 sweet spot, I7 models tend to run very hot.
Too hot for long life. Standard is a terrible low resolution poor contrast screen, it is easy to change though, shop should be able to do
it in 30 mins, DIY be careful to route cable correctly at hinge area.

• This reply was modified 1 year, 3 months ago by ModdIt.

[Member blur13]

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Its my dream to aquire a Thinkpad X220, its suposed to be the last model made with an excellent keyboard. Apparently build quility quickly declined after that model. However, the X220 is very hard to find where I live. The search goes on.

I’ve seen some really cool blogs posted on hacker news of ppl using models of thinkpads from circa 2012, refitting them, upgrading them, switching parts etc, to make them usable as daily drivers.

[Member PPC]

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@DaveW – For minimum hardware to use the modern web in antiX, I would recommend anything that has a 64bits multi core and at least 2 Gig of RAM- anything above that does make your “new” computer more future proof- i.e- will probably last longer, be more compatible with more modern web standards- but we can’t really be sure, if Meta has it’s way, 5 years from now most computing will be done using VR/AR glasses…

P.

[Member olsztyn]

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blur13 wrote:

Its my dream to aquire a Thinkpad X220, its suposed to be the last model made with an excellent keyboard. Apparently build quility quickly declined after that model. However, the X220 is very hard to find where I live.

A few years ago I bought two X220 thinkpads on eBay for about $100 each (no drives), so one I gave to my daughter. I occasionally look at eBay for such and it seems the prices for Thinkpads in general still hold up, not coming down. I just looked again and see one for $107 with 8Gb RAM, as an example.
Yes, the keyboards for those earlier Thinkpads are excellent and another advantage is that they are easily replaceable. Keyboard for X220 is the same as for many other Thinkpad models, up to Thinkpad T410 and T520, Build quality declined afterwards, indeed.

• This reply was modified 1 year, 3 months ago by olsztyn.

Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_Parameters

[Member olsztyn]

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ModdIt wrote:

T410 420 430 are very solidly built, later models still robust but not as much so. Core I5 sweet spot, I7 models tend to run very hot.
Too hot for long life. Standard is a terrible low resolution poor contrast screen, it is easy to change though,

In my case I do not experience issues with them running hot.
My Thinkpad X220 (small) and two T520 (15.6 inch) are all i7 and are just fine temperature wise, similar to my Thinkpads T410 (i5). One of my T520 is sitting on my desk running constantly.
On the screen resolution:
It all depends on specific models, as there are many combinations within the same model line. My two Thinkpads T520 are 1920×1080 high definition IPS true color screens with high contrast. My Thinkpads T410 are 1440×900 resolution, which for their 14 inch factor is very good too.
Standard non-Thinkpad laptops are coming with 1366×768, which for their ‘standard’ 15.6 inch size is not too good IMO…

Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_Parameters

[Member DaveW]

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Thanks to everyone for your thoughts about Thinkpads and trustworthy models. I will keep my eyes open.

Moddit,
I don’t think it is a heat problem, because the issue seems to occur within the first few seconds or minutes after start-up. If it gets past the first 30 minutes, it will usually run all day.

I replaced the Bios battery a few months ago. But it didn’t make a difference. The old battery was a little low, but not dead.

I did try the 5.10.xxx kernel (with similar issues). I don’t remember whether I tried the 4.19.xxx kernel (but probably).

Edit: An important note, which was left out of original: I am running this unit without a main battery (directly from AC power supply/charger). It is being used as desktop, never portable.

Here is a portion of INXI info:

System:    Kernel: 4.9.0-294-antix.1-486-smp i686 bits: 32 compiler: gcc v: 6.3.0 
           parameters: BOOT_IMAGE=/boot/vmlinuz-4.9.0-294-antix.1-486-smp 
           root=UUID=396941a0-ff65-41e0-ae0e-82798778afea ro vga=791 quiet apparmor=1 
           security=apparmor 
           Desktop: IceWM 1.4.2 info: icewmtray dm: SLiM 1.3.4 
           Distro: antiX-17.1_386-base Heather Heyer 17 March 2018 
           base: Debian GNU/Linux 9 (stretch) 
Machine:   Type: Portable System: Dell product: Latitude D620 v: N/A serial: <filter> Chassis: 
           type: 8 serial: <filter> 
           Mobo: Dell model: 0FT292 serial: <filter> BIOS: Dell v: A10 date: 05/16/2008 
Memory:    RAM: total: 1.96 GiB used: 951.6 MiB (47.5%) 
           RAM Report: permissions: Unable to run dmidecode. Root privileges required. 
PCI Slots: Permissions: Unable to run dmidecode. Root privileges required. 
CPU:       Info: Dual Core model: Intel Core2 T5600 bits: 64 type: MCP arch: Core Merom family: 6 
           model-id: F (15) stepping: 2 microcode: 57 cache: L2: 2 MiB bogomips: 7323 
           Speed: 1000 MHz min/max: 1000/1833 MHz Core speeds (MHz): 1: 1000 2: 1333 
           Flags: acpi aperfmperf apic arch_perfmon bts clflush cmov constant_tsc cx16 cx8 de 
           ds_cpl dtes64 dtherm dts est fpu fxsr ht lahf_lm lm mca mce mmx monitor msr mtrr nx pae 
           pat pbe pdcm pebs pge pni pse pse36 sep ss sse sse2 ssse3 tm tm2 tpr_shadow tsc vme vmx 
           xtpr 
           Vulnerabilities: Type: itlb_multihit status: KVM: Vulnerable 
           Type: l1tf status: Vulnerable 
           Type: mds status: Vulnerable: Clear CPU buffers attempted, no microcode; SMT disabled 
           Type: meltdown status: Vulnerable 
           Type: spec_store_bypass status: Vulnerable 
           Type: spectre_v1 mitigation: usercopy/swapgs barriers and __user pointer sanitization 
           Type: spectre_v2 mitigation: Full generic retpoline, STIBP: disabled, RSB filling 
           Type: srbds status: Not affected 
           Type: tsx_async_abort status: Not affected 
Graphics:  Device-1: Intel Mobile 945GM/GMS 943/940GML Express Integrated Graphics vendor: Dell 
           driver: i915 v: kernel bus-ID: 00:02.0 chip-ID: 8086:27a2 class-ID: 0300 
           Display: server: X.Org 1.19.2 driver: loaded: intel unloaded: fbdev,modesetting,vesa 
           display-ID: :0.0 screens: 1 
           Screen-1: 0 s-res: 1280x800 s-dpi: 96 s-size: 338x211mm (13.3x8.3") 
           s-diag: 398mm (15.7") 
           Monitor-1: LVDS1 res: 1280x800 hz: 60 dpi: 108 size: 300x190mm (11.8x7.5") 
           diag: 355mm (14") 
           OpenGL: renderer: Mesa DRI Intel 945GM x86/MMX/SSE2 v: 2.1 Mesa 13.0.6 
           direct render: Yes 

A couple of years ago, I replaced the mainboard. The new one is:
Board: Dell Inc. 0FT292
Serial Number: .HM8TWC1.CN1296174ED994.

Processor info (lscpu):

Architecture:          i686
CPU op-mode(s):        32-bit, 64-bit
Byte Order:            Little Endian
CPU(s):                2
On-line CPU(s) list:   0,1
Thread(s) per core:    1
Core(s) per socket:    2
Socket(s):             1
Vendor ID:             GenuineIntel
CPU family:            6
Model:                 15
Model name:            Intel(R) Core(TM)2 CPU         T5600  @ 1.83GHz
Stepping:              2
CPU MHz:               1833.000
CPU max MHz:           1833.0000
CPU min MHz:           1000.0000
BogoMIPS:              3661.65
Virtualization:        VT-x
L1d cache:             32K
L1i cache:             32K
L2 cache:              2048K
Flags:                 fpu vme de pse tsc msr pae mce cx8 apic sep mtrr pge mca cmov pat pse36 clflush dts acpi mmx fxsr sse sse2 ss ht tm pbe nx lm constant_tsc arch_perfmon pebs bts aperfmperf pni dtes64 monitor ds_cpl vmx est tm2 ssse3 cx16 xtpr pdcm lahf_lm tpr_shadow dtherm

Thank you.

• This reply was modified 1 year, 3 months ago by DaveW. Reason: a line of information was ommitted from original

[Forum Admin rokytnji]

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My T430. With broken keyboard and gobs of ram with a I5 cpu just keeps chugging along.
What broke on the keyboard was the volume and brightness quick control plastics that cover the buttons. The buttons still work.
Came from a business sale for cheap. With a power brick. I changed dvdrw and never looked back.
It is more of my desktop computer because of the below. I paid good money for that broken keyboard IBM T430 with no operating system but everything there including insane ram amount. 200 bucks. Bought it back when they fairly new though.

What kills me. My ChromeBook antiX 19 is quicker than the IBM. I Blame platter drive in the IBM vs the ssd in the chromebook.
Chromebook has a less powerful dual core cpu and less ram than the IBM T430. Chromebook cost me new back when they were new. Acer C710 $139.00.
But it flies on antiX. So it has been the travel laptop on the motorcycle. Battery still good after all these years.

Taking the place of my older single core atom N270 touchscreen clamshell netbook. < parked on the shelf in the man cave >
The below was costing 45 bucks used from Texas school auctions with a good battery and power brick included. Windows XP loaded.

https://www.notebookcheck.net/M-A-Technology-Inc-Companion-Touch.24767.0.html

The interwebs is trying to outran those. antiX still runs on em though. I liked em because they are water resistant and can be dropped.

Plus: I got a twisted itch when I read

This average evaluation is exceptionally bad. There exist hardly any laptops, which are rated so negative.

Used to read reviews like this on antiX back in the day.

Sometimes I drive a crooked road to get my mind straight.
Not all who Wander are Lost.
I'm not outa place. I'm from outer space.

Linux Registered User # 475019
How to Search for AntiX solutions to your problems

[Member ModdIt]

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Not knowing what has already been done, a pretty general and surely improvable set of fault finding tips, apply in kind to desktops computers phones powerbanks chargers
and vehicle components.

Power supplies: BE CAREFUL, the big caps are deadly. Safest is do not open a PSU, if you must, discharge the caps and short them with a resistor which you then solder
over the terminals to be sure no residual charge sends you to your grave.

Start with different power source, running all the time from the brick max stresses it, high temperatures dry out caps giving unstable working in particular at start.
Have seen problems with the cable being badly connected to plug, at device end it gets a lot of stress. Usual fix is replace power brick.
Check socket to board connection, In a good shop in Hannover they are resoldered on suspicion when accessible.
Check all capacitors near power supply connector for any signs of bulging or leakage, I use 8x magnifier since finding a pinhole sized defect in a capacitor top. That
was in a monitor PSU but any electrolytic caps can be affected.
Remove RAM clean off contacts with iso alcohol and reseat it. If more than one socket is in use sometimes a system runs stable with one piece inserted. Is a common shop
check. Seems when the chips and sucomponents get old timing can drift off to borderline.
Check screen connection, both the connector and look for signs of any damage where the cable goes from case to screen in hinge area. Very common to find issues there
especialy on devices which have had screen replacement in past.

Then if you want to dig deeper it gets dirty, Carefully check for any signs of hairy or fluffy looking solder joints as well as any discoloration or corrosion.
The hairy joints are due whiskers growing out of the solder, they can and do cause short circuits or partial short circuits between contacts, the effects range
widely, from weird symptoms to component destruction.
Early lead free soldered boards aged very badly. Any suspects clean with isipropanol destilled water dry and resolder where possible.
Tap or lightly press on chips using an insulated probe. That often helps where faulty early lead free solder is involved. Intent is find cracked solder joints
which are often extremely hard to see, Shop uses a stereo camera setup and a big screen, maybe a digicam on a tripod live connection and monitor could imitate
that, possibly some kinds of action cam too, distortion does not rally matter, just clear detail of connections.
you can use a cold spray and shock cool chips, that if done carefully can aid in diagnostics, it can also finish a chip where
the internal layer contacts are faulty.

Louis Rossman Videos are well worth watching for tips including on soldering resoldering fault finding , many on youtube are on an extremely amateur level, he is not.

[Member DaveW]

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Moddit,
Thank you for your detailed advice on checking for problems and hopefully fixing them.
As a retired electronics technician, I’m familiar with many of your points.
But you have provided many helpful suggestions, and encouragement.
I appreciate it, greatly.

[Moderator Brian Masinick]

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For what it’s worth, I looked around a bit and found a good refurbishing company called backmarket.com.

They sell refurbished equipment from various companies and they handle a pretty good range of Thinkpad models from the past 11 years or so.

They ensure that their refurbished equipment really is refurbished, such as cleaning up and even replacing parts. The models, because of this may not be the absolute cheapest but they are guaranteed to work and have warranty along with the product.

Check them out.

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Brian Masinick

[Author]

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