Debian Bookworm Installer RC3 (latest update)

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  • This topic has 10 replies, 3 voices, and was last updated May 17-7:19 pm by Brian Masinick.
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  • #104017
    Moderator
    Brian Masinick

      The Debian Installer team[1] is pleased to announce the first release
      candidate of the installer for Debian 12 “Bookworm”.

      The Debian Installer team thanks everybody who has contributed to this
      release.

      1. http://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Team
      2. http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/errata
      3. http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer

      • This topic was modified 1 year, 1 month ago by Brian Masinick.

      --
      Brian Masinick

      #104474
      Moderator
      Brian Masinick

        http://linuxiac.com/debian-12-a-closer-look/

        This article gives a lot of information about the upcoming Debian 12 (Bookworm) release and accordingly it may provide a few hints about how close we are to a potential antiX 23 release.

        I don’t know for certain if we can anticipate the antiX 23 release to precede the Debian 12 release, closely match it or follow it. That will depend on what we in the community test and contribute and what we can complete with or without Debian. We’d be blind and misguided to think we are completely independent of Debian, but we’d be equally blind to see the many things we have built, replaced, enhanced or improved.

        I’ve been a long time Debian user and an even longer Linux user, and a past UNIX developer and user. When Debian replaced the classic Linux sysvinit program with systemd, a powerful but questionable development by another organization (Red Hat), it fractured quite a bit of the community, to the point that a Debian fork called Devuan was formed. The antiX team initially chose this approach to preserve the legacy established. The team also investigated other options and has been using one, the “runit” init system as an alternative and is considering other alternatives for future efforts.

        Where I’m going with this is that even in freely available software there’s disagreement and choices to make. Debian still works. I use siduction, a Debian Sid alternative and it definitely works well. We know very well that antiX works great. Endeavour OS is a great distribution based on Arch Linux that makes Arch Linux usable without a graduate degree in system administration or Computer Science.

        My point is that there are many options out there. Our job here is to collaborate on the antiX distribution to keep it both lean and efficient while usable and relevant. We’ve made some very useful options and choices available. Choice means more than one way to assemble our own systems.

        Today we use some of the best components from the Debian project, a collection of applications and tools from developers all over the world including some of us. No one person has made everything. Even Linus Torvalds and Richard Stallman have benefited from the efforts of thousands of people. Our own efforts include a few people who are no longer with us.

        I’m thankful for everyone, those with ideas we like and those who think differently. Sometimes our diversity ends up resulting in more ideas; some work, some don’t. While our relatively small project can’t outdo everything, we’ve done some things that have created a terrific niche for old stuff and fast, lean stuff.

        I’m excited to see it through.

        --
        Brian Masinick

        #104484
        Member
        Xunzi_23

          makes Arch Linux usable without a graduate degree in system administration or Computer Science.

          Thanks made me grin, arch is a challenge at times but not that bad. Sometimes I miss the fun and games.

          I have also converted Manjaro to pure arch, probably still doable although now Manjaro has some own repos.

          real challenge try Gentoo 🙂

          #104486
          Moderator
          Brian Masinick

            Yeah, Gentoo Linux is another one like Arch Linux – EXTREMELY flexible and customizable – if you have nothing else to do with your time!

            I’m retired and I do have some time but now my time is more filled with things I can do with the people that I love and that’s more important than practically writing my own interface for my system!

            I do like systems that are highly configurable. Our own distributions are very configurable but they also are preconfigured so you can use them immediately and fine tune them for your specific interests and requirements.

            I think that Gentoo Linux may have a preconfigured environment available. For whatever reason it never quite fit me and that’s what I do appreciate about the hundreds of different systems and configurations.

            I argue repeatedly that free software and commercial software are choices that ought to be available. My wife gets only as close to the software and hardware as preconfigured systems provide. She used Microsoft Windows for 30-35 years of her life and then their school tried out some inexpensive Chromebook models and she’s been using them ever since.

            She also uses an Android phone so all of her network use has a Linux kernel but she’s never been a Linux desktop user.

            Six or seven years ago I got my own mother and a neighbor across the street to use an extremely simple antiX setup. Their computers were old and slow, positive point one. The default settings have too many choices for those cases so I greatly simplified it. In both situations I found out exactly what they used so I created custom configurations that would log directly into the most common thing and has fewer than five toolbar buttons they could press once to access what they needed; simple, fast, and easy for me to customize and easy for them to use!

            --
            Brian Masinick

            #105559
            Moderator
            Brian Masinick

                bookworm release planned on 2023-06-10 and the last weeks up to the release

              Release date
              ============

              We plan to release on 2023-06-10.

              If you want to celebrate it, please consider attending a Debian
              release party, or hosting your own! See
              http://wiki.debian.org/ReleasePartyBookworm for more information.
              (Note: the release process typically takes the whole day and the
              release isn’t done until the early hours of Sunday UTC.)

              Full Freeze date
              ================

              With the release date set, it’s time to announce the Full Freeze [1]
              date: Wednesday 2023-05-24. This means that from that moment on, every
              package requires a manual unblock [2] by the release team if it needs
              to migrate to bookworm. Please note that, as with all freezes, the new
              rules apply for all packages that haven’t migrated to testing yet (not
              only for uploads after the freeze).

              For all uploads, please review the Freeze Policy [1] once again to
              make sure you know what is appropriate at this phase of the release.

              The final weeks up to the release
              =================================

              In the last week prior to the freeze, testing will be completely
              frozen and only emergency bug fixes will be considered in this period.
              Please consider Sunday 2023-05-28 at 12:00 UTC the absolute last
              moment for submitting unblock requests for bookworm.

              Changes that are not ready to migrate [3] to testing at that time will
              not be included in bookworm for the initial release. However, you can
              still fix bugs in bookworm via point releases if the changeset follows
              the rules for updates in stable.

              Upgrade testing
              ===============

              If you are in a position to carry out upgrade testing from bullseye to
              bookworm in the field, now is the time to do so and send your feedback
              as a bug report against the “upgrade-reports” pseudo-package.

              Release notes
              =============

              Please ensure that any information about your packages which should
              form part of the release notes is prepared in plenty of time to allow
              for review and translations. Release notes coordination happens in the
              BTS in bugs filed against the “release-notes” pseudo-package and in
              merge requests on salsa [4].

              For the release team,
              Paul

              [1] http://release.debian.org/testing/freeze_policy.html#full
              [2] please use $(reportbug release.debian.org) to get the tags and
              template right
              [3] The testing migration excuses must not mention *blocked* (due to
              dependency issues, CI or piuparts failures or other reasons). It is
              acceptable if the required age has not been reached at this time.
              [4] http://salsa.debian.org/ddp-team/release-notes/

              --
              Brian Masinick

              #106952
              Moderator
              Brian Masinick

                Debian Installer Bookworm RC 3 release

                The Debian Installer team[1] is pleased to announce the third release
                candidate of the installer for Debian 12 “Bookworm”.

                Improvements in this release
                ============================

                * finish-install:
                – Adjust APT cache cleaning to avoid breaking bash completion
                (#1034650).
                * grub-installer:
                – Detect EFI boot variables with hexadecimal digits, not only
                decimal digits.
                * hw-detect:
                – Restore support for firmware license prompts (#1033921).
                * linux:
                – Build against updated dwarves, reducing its size and memory
                footprint (#1033301).
                * partman-base:
                – Add support for input submitted using power-of-two units: kiB,
                MiB, GiB, etc. (#913431). Note that sizes are still output using
                power-of-ten units: kB, MB, GB, etc.
                – Add support for bigger prefixes: petabyte (PB), pebibyte (PiB),
                exabyte (EB), and exbibyte (EiB).
                – With many thanks to Vincent Danjean!
                * preseed:
                – Make sure netcfg considers DHCP-provided hostnames, only using
                the hostname parameter on the kernel command line as a fallback
                (#1035349).

                Hardware support changes
                ========================

                * debian-installer:
                – Ship dedicated DRM modules for bochs and cirrus to avoid broken
                graphics under UEFI/Secure Boot (#1036019).
                * linux:
                – Work around black screen on ppc64el (#1033058).
                * xorg-server:
                – Ship modesetting_drv.so in the udeb again, fixing graphical
                installer support on UTM (#1035014).

                Localization status
                ===================

                * 78 languages are supported in this release.
                * Full translation for 41 of them.

                Known bugs in this release
                ==========================

                * There seems to be no known major bug as of yet.

                See the errata[2] for details and a full list of known issues.

                Feedback for this release
                =========================

                We need your help to find bugs and further improve the installer, so
                please try it. Installation images, and everything else you will need
                are available at our web site[3].

                Thanks
                ======

                The Debian Installer team thanks everybody who has contributed to this
                release.

                1. http://wiki.debian.org/DebianInstaller/Team
                2. http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer/errata
                3. http://www.debian.org/devel/debian-installer

                Cheers,

                Cyril Brulebois (kibi@debian.org) <http://debamax.com/>
                D-I release manager — Release team member — Freelance Consultant

                --
                Brian Masinick

                #107028
                Member
                marcelocripe

                  I argue repeatedly that free software and commercial software are choices that ought to be available. My wife gets only as close to the software and hardware as preconfigured systems provide. She used Microsoft Windows for 30-35 years of her life and then their school tried out some inexpensive Chromebook models and she’s been using them ever since.

                  She also uses an Android phone so all of her network use has a Linux kernel but she’s never been a Linux desktop user.

                  Six or seven years ago I got my own mother and a neighbor across the street to use an extremely simple antiX setup. Their computers were old and slow, positive point one. The default settings have too many choices for those cases so I greatly simplified it. In both situations I found out exactly what they used so I created custom configurations that would log directly into the most common thing and has fewer than five toolbar buttons they could press once to access what they needed; simple, fast, and easy for me to customize and easy for them to use!

                  Hello Mr. Brian.

                  I don’t know if this is the right thread for us to address this issue, but I would like to comment on your words.

                  You described in your text the example of your wife and your neighbor, these examples describe exactly the reality of most people who are end users of operating systems. I serve several people, whether installing Windows or antiX. Of course, I am always very happy when I manage to convince the end user that antiX is the best choice, that thanks to antiX their computer will be able to be used for many years and that the same does not happen with Windows. In general people don’t want to know how it works, what is the programming language or if it’s based on Debian 11 or something else, people just want to click and see it working and it has to be as fast as possible. In this, antiX has a lot of advantage when compared to other operating systems maintained by companies.

                  I am also grateful for every single person who has made and continues to make antiX what it is and what it could be.

                  When Debian replaced the classic Linux sysvinit program with systemd, a powerful but questionable development by another organization (Red Hat), it fractured quite a bit of the community, to the point that a Debian fork called Devuan was formed. The antiX team initially chose this approach to preserve the legacy established.

                  And in this part of your text, you comment on the problematic issue that affects us, which is SystemD. As I’ve written before, I don’t know if this is the right thread for us to address this issue. I wonder how long antiX can continue to work with Debian packages, given the increasing introduction of SystemD or EloginD with dependencies on various programs. I imagine that at some point antiX will no longer be able to use the Debian repositories and will need to switch. Could it be from Devuan? And my other question: “How long will the free SystemD distributions remain distant from each other?” or “The free SystemD distributions will have to catch up with each other at some point”.

                  – – – – –

                  I argue repeatedly that free software and commercial software are choices that ought to be available. My wife gets only as close to the software and hardware as preconfigured systems provide. She used Microsoft Windows for 30-35 years of her life and then their school tried out some inexpensive Chromebook models and she’s been using them ever since.

                  She also uses an Android phone so all of her network use has a Linux kernel but she’s never been a Linux desktop user.

                  Six or seven years ago I got my own mother and a neighbor across the street to use an extremely simple antiX setup. Their computers were old and slow, positive point one. The default settings have too many choices for those cases so I greatly simplified it. In both situations I found out exactly what they used so I created custom configurations that would log directly into the most common thing and has fewer than five toolbar buttons they could press once to access what they needed; simple, fast, and easy for me to customize and easy for them to use!

                  Olá sr. Brian.

                  Eu não sei se este é o tópico correto para tratarmos deste assunto, mas eu gostaria de fazer as minhas considerações quanto às suas palavras.

                  O senhor descreveu no seu texto o exemplo da sua esposa e do seu vizinho, estes exemplos descrevem exatamente a realidade da maioria das pessoas que são usuários finais dos sistemas operacionais. Eu atendo diversas pessoas, seja instalando o Windows ou o antiX. É claro que eu sempre fico muito contente quando eu consigo convencer o usuário final de que o antiX é a melhor escolha, que graças ao antiX o seu computador poderá ser utilizado por muitos anos e que o mesmo não acontece com o Windows. No geral as pessoas não querem saber como funciona, qual é a linguagem de programação ou se é baseado no Debian 11 ou em outra “coisa”, as pessoas só querem clicar e ver funcionando e tem que ser o mais rápido possível. Nisso o antiX leva muita vantagem quando comparado aos outros sistemas operacionais que mantidos por empresas.

                  Eu também sou grato por cada pessoa que fez e continua fazendo o antiX ser o que ele é e o que poderia ser.

                  When Debian replaced the classic Linux sysvinit program with systemd, a powerful but questionable development by another organization (Red Hat), it fractured quite a bit of the community, to the point that a Debian fork called Devuan was formed. The antiX team initially chose this approach to preserve the legacy established.

                  E nesta parte do seu texto, o senhor comenta sobre a questão problemática que nos atinge, que é o SystemD. Como eu escrevi antes, eu não sei se este é o tópico correto para tratarmos deste assunto. Eu me pergunto até quando o antiX poderá continuar funcionando com os pacotes do Debian, haja vista a crescente introdução do SystemD ou do EloginD com dependência de vários programas. Eu imagino que em algum momento o antiX não poderá mais utilizar os repositórios do Debian e precisará mudar. Será que deverá ser do Devuan? E a minha outra pergunta: “Até quando as distribuições livres do SystemD continuarão distantes umas das outras?” ou “As distribuições livres do SystemD terão que se aproximar umas das outras em algum momento”.

                  #107033
                  Moderator
                  Brian Masinick

                    Marcelo, regarding the antiX and Debian related software, there are always alternatives. As we’ve seen already, antiX has been able to maintain sysvinitd (the classic “System V init” routine), which Linux used for a long time. I’m pretty sure that it’s a complete rewrite, but it’s possible that it came from some freely available sources, possibly in the BSD domain; it’s definitely NOT the original UNIX System V code, because at the time that Linux became available, it definitely wasn’t “FREE”, either in “freedom” or in cost; these were some of the reasons the GNU project started, and they also had a direct influence on Linus Torvalds writing his first Linux kernel because the other available options were really expensive, especially for a university student!

                    I wouldn’t worry about systemD; it is but one of at least a half dozen alternatives; our recent favorite is runit. When we started discussing future directions, anticapitalista also indicated that in the future he MAY look at one or two other options, for instance, there are Upstart, Epoch, Mudar, and systemd; the only one I’ve even tried among these is systemd and it actually works fine.

                    http://www.linux-magazine.com/Online/Features/A-Survey-of-Init-Systems discusses a few init systems and provides some information for those who want to learn.

                    http://www.slant.co/options/12956/alternatives/~systemd-alternatives is another article. I’m not finding at the moment exactly what I was looking for; there are even more init options than this; I’ll search through our forums later to retrieve the discussion where anticapitalista mentioned two possible init alternatives; believe me, there are more, so we NEVER have to resort to systemd unless a particular individual wants to remaster antiX with it; I can guarantee you that it won’t come from anticapitalista based on consistent statements and history.

                    --
                    Brian Masinick

                    #107034
                    Moderator
                    Brian Masinick

                      s6 and dinit are two pretty good alternatives, for example. Maybe they were the ones; if someone doesn’t beat me to it, I’ll confirm later.

                      --
                      Brian Masinick

                      #107036
                      Member
                      marcelocripe

                        Mr. Brian, what I said refers to the fact that several programs that are available in the Debian repository require SystemD and for those of us who don’t want that it is an obstacle. if a user needs a program that depends on SystemD to run it won’t work, because we don’t want SystemD. So in my view the Debian repository tends to prevent it from being used in antiX. It makes more sense to me for free SystemD distributions to come together and share their repositories rather than repositories with SystemD.

                        – – – – –

                        Sr. Brian, o que eu havia dito refere-se ao fato que vários programas que estão disponíveis no repositório do Debian exigem o SystemD e para nós que não queremos isso é um obstáculo. se um usuário precisa de um programa que depende do SystemD para funcionar ele não vai funcionar, porque não queremos o SystemD. Então na minha visão o repositório do Debian tende a impedir que seja utilizado no antiX. Faz mais sentido para mim as distribuições livres do SystemD se unirem e passarem a compartilharem os seus repositórios em detrimento aos repositórios com o SystemD.

                        #107038
                        Moderator
                        Brian Masinick

                          When there are systemd packages, yes, I would avoid them too, at least when using antiX.

                          Once I accidentally included an update that pulled in a couple of incorrect packages and anticapitalista spotted them and pointed out the specifics.

                          Generally speaking use the antiX update and the package priority will protect most instances of it happening.
                          also use the package installer and if there are applications you need, please let us know so they can be considered.
                          Frankly between the distributions we offer, the package installer and the occasional tools the community builds there is a more than adequate choice, at least for me.

                          If you require anything else please explain it in detail.

                          Thank you as always for your contribution, your excellent attention to detail and your helpful forum messages.

                          --
                          Brian Masinick

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