debian apt solver changes

[Member dgh]

I saw the bit on DistroWatch about Debian changing apt to make it more difficult to remove ‘essential’ and ‘protected’ packages– shortly after I posted sorta goofing that we wouldn’t be able to remove PulseAudio, I saw anticap’s post about having trouble with systemd.

Has the obstacle been resolved?
Is there a thread dedicated to this issue? (I looked around but didn’t find anything)
Have other systemd-free projects been consulted?
Is this another thinly veiled attack against systemd opponents or is it a legitimate side effect of an unrelated design decision?

I’m not a developer, so I’m really just asking as a concerned user.

Thanks for any info that can be provided. Also, sorry if this is the wrong subforum. Couldn’t decide if it was more about Debian or more about antiX development.

• This topic was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by dgh.

[Member Xecure]

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The apt change added a new option (that originally wasn’t needed before, because it was the default behavior) to remove the protection of essential packages
-o APT::Get::Allow-Solver-Remove-Essential=1

So probably the build-iso tools need an update for future antiX 22-23 release, so that building systemd-free antiX ISO’s in the future can be done.

antiX Live system enthusiast.
General Live Boot Parameters for antiX.

[Member PPC]

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Very probably this change was due to Linus Sebastian, the you-tuber from Linus Tech Tips YouTube Channel- that is making a series about using Linux, and in the very first episode, due to a bug that existed in the distro he had just installed, when trying to install Steam, to play some sames, ended up removing his entire desktop by mistake- the bug got solved, and in the next few days this change in apt came up…
Until recently I never heard of LTT, but it seems to be the biggest tech related channel in Youtube, with over 14 million subscribers (yeah MILLION), so it seems to be important enough so Debian instantly changed apt’s default behavior…

P.

[Member ModdIt]

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14 million subscribers (yeah MILLION), so it seems to be important enough so Debian instantly changed apt’s default behavior…

That channel makes the guy Big Big money. Many of the actions on video are ckickbait to get more.
Above a certain level it is all about Pay per veiw…

He probably really enjoyed exploiting a chain which made me hate system D. It has been around for some years.
The so called bug in apt is blaming for the madness pöttering introduced and debian wholeheartedly embracing it.
I suspect soon changing your screen background will take down gnome desktop entirely. HomeD is on the way.

• This reply was modified 1 year, 5 months ago by ModdIt.

[Forum Admin anticapitalista]

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The change was requested by (commercial) POP! OS, apparently

Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

[Member stevesr0]

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Since I have not seen anything about a “fix” that would allow users to deal with packages they wish to remove or add that the modified apt refuses to allow, I wonder how to remove and install packages that are rejected by apt?

If we are running the affected apt version (2.3.12 IIRC), can we modify the options to allow changes to allow removal of essential protected packages by simply editing one of the apt configuration text files?

Is it possible to remove packages that apt refuses to by using dpkg?

Is there going to be an update for antiX users who have had a problem because of this modification in apt? (Does it only affect antiX users of version 21 and testing/unstable/Sid?

stevers0

[Forum Admin anticapitalista]

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It only affected antiX users of version 21 and testing/unstable/Sid
I built apt to revert to the old way and debs are already in the repos.

Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

[Member Xecure]

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stevesr0 wrote:

I wonder how to remove and install packages that are rejected by apt?

Install package that removes essential package
sudo apt install <package-name> -o APT::Get::Allow-Solver-Remove-Essential=true

Purge a package that will remove an essential dependency:
sudo apt purge <package-name> -o APT::Get::Allow-Solver-Remove-Essential=true

antiX Live system enthusiast.
General Live Boot Parameters for antiX.

[Member stevesr0]

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Thanks Xecure for how to.

So, if for example, one wanted to remove the installed package sysvinit-utils in order to install the runit version (sysvinit-utils-antix), you could run

sudo apt install sysvinit-utils-antix -o APT::Get::Allow-Solver-Remove-Essential=true

stevesr0

[Forum Admin anticapitalista]

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stevesr0 wrote:

Thanks Xecure for how to.

So, if for example, one wanted to remove the installed package sysvinit-utils in order to install the runit version (sysvinit-utils-antix), you could run

sudo apt install sysvinit-utils-antix -o APT::Get::Allow-Solver-Remove-Essential=true

stevesr0

That will probably break it.
If you want to try runit, use the runit version.
http://iso.mxrepo.com/Downloads/Final/antiX-19.3/runit-sid/

Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

[Member Xecure]

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Should be, but the version for runit is incomplete, compared to the other one.
” sysvinit-utils-antix” is more of a compatibility layer for antiX’s runit, so that sysvinit services (that have no runit alternative) still work and are loaded.

Don’t install it without first installing runit properly. If you don’t know how to configure runit from zero, don’t know how to replace an init and don’t know either the packages you need to achieve this, don’t start this experiment.

I have been diving in to runit, but I would never attempt to do it from zero as anticapitalista has. The required linux knowledge need for replacing an init and a service manager is waaaaay above my paygrade.

I really thank anticapitalista on his work for making us mortals be able to use and explore other init systems. Maybe some time in the future I explore s6, but right now I am very happy with how anticapitalista has configured runit on antiX. Maybe when s6 gets the service management promised for alpine linux (if I am not mistaken, the s6 creator has a sponsor to create this and it has been endorsed by the Alpine Linux devs) I may show interest on it, but I have no intentions of exploring it for now.

PS: Sorry for the off-topic.

• This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by Xecure.

antiX Live system enthusiast.
General Live Boot Parameters for antiX.

[Member stevesr0]

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hi anticapitalista and Xecure,

Thanks for comments.

I was only asking to confirm the “guide” with a specific example, to double check my understanding of how to remove and install essential packages that apt resists doing.

At the moment, I am working hard to understand the antiX systems that I currently am running <g>.

stevesr0

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