discussion on desktop files and translations

[Anonymous]

I’m starting this thread for discussing what changes, ideas, and corrections
would help with translating the desktop file comments and generic names for
new users and users in other countries.

I had a hard time following the other thread on video reviews that went in many directions.

One question I had was instead of a place in /usr/share would /usr/local be a better place
for the specific changed files?

I like the idea of a post install script or package to revert any apt/synaptic changes from upstream.

Also I agree with keeping the original package name, just changing the generic and comments.

[Anonymous]

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One question I have for Robin and Marcelocripe …

Is it possible to edit them on Gitlab and hitting replace?

I’m already a member on there.

—————— original text in English ———————————

Uma pergunta que tenho para Robin e Marcelocripe …

É possível editá-los no Gitlab e substituí-los?

Eu já sou membro lá.

[Member iznit]

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stored in a subdirectory of /usr/local/ sounds cool

What are these….. modified .desktop files for all the preinstalled antixFull /usr/share/applications files?
How will these be deployed? Added to a future package version of “desktop-defaults-antix” [[[ or ? “desktop-menu-antix” ]]]

[Anonymous]

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@marcelocripe,

your English comment on cherrytree application on the other post makes it a lot clearer in English for users
that are not familiar with it.

[Member marcelocripe]

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Hello Linuxdaddy.

I really like the idea of ​​dedicating a topic focused on the specific topic. But for this topic to achieve its goal, it will need other people to participate as well. When people don’t participate, the topic looks like this: Suggested Review of .desktop File Translations

I will try to answer each item you mentioned.

Here is the snippet from the other thread:

marcelocripe wrote:

What is cherrytree used for? Or, what does cherrytree do?

I don’t know what the ideal structure of the English language looks like, so I don’t know if the automatic translator is showing me correctly. I can quote the model from the text in my language. In the same way that I adapt the automatic translation text from the English language to the Brazilian Portuguese language, the adaptation of the Brazilian Portuguese language to the English language may be necessary, but it has to be proofread by a native of the English language.

Originate in English language:

Name=CherryTree
Comment=Hierarchical Note Taking

Adaptation to Brazilian Portuguese:

Name[pt_BR]=Organizador de Notas CherryTree
Comment[pt_BR]=Organizador de notas hierárquicas com recursos de texto rico, destaque de sintaxe e armazenamento de dados em um único arquivo XML ou SQLite.

Suggestion for English language (requires proofreading by a native English speaker):

Name=CherryTree Hierarchical Note Taking
Comment=Hierarchical note organizer with rich text capabilities, syntax highlighting and data storage in a single XML or SQLite file.

The original English name was kept, I included two or three words before or after the name, this feature can make a lot of difference when a user looks at the menu and reads what CherryTree does or proposes to do.

The comment needs to have more information, it needs to have more details and information. If any information in the text is wrong, all necessary improvements will be very welcome, I built this text with research I did on the internet, it may be that the comment is wrong.

– – – – –

Olá Linuxdaddy.

Eu gosto muito da ideia de dedicar um tópico focado sobre o tema específico. Mas para este tópico atingir o seu objetivo, precisará que as outras pessoas também participem. Quando não há a participação das pessoas, o tópico fica igual a este: Suggested Review of .desktop File Translations

Aqui está o trecho do outro tópico:

marcelocripe escreveu:

Para que serve o cherrytree? Ou, o que o cherrytree faz?

Eu não sei como é a estrutura ideal do idioma Inglês, então, eu não sei se o tradutor automático está me mostrando corretamente. Eu posso citar o modelo do texto em meu idioma. Da mesma forma que eu adapto o texto da tradução automática do idioma Inglês para o idioma Português do Brasil, a adaptação do idioma Português do Brasil para idioma Inglês pode ser necessária, mas tem que ser revisada por um nativo do idioma Inglês.

Originam em idioma Inglês:

Name=CherryTree
Comment=Hierarchical Note Taking

Adaptação para o idioma Português do Brasil:

Name[pt_BR]=Organizador de Notas CherryTree
Comment[pt_BR]=Organizador de notas hierárquicas com recursos de texto rico, destaque de sintaxe e armazenamento de dados em um único arquivo XML ou SQLite.

Sugestão para idioma Inglês (é necessário a revisão do texto por um nativo do idioma Inglês):

Name=CherryTree Hierarchical Note Taking
Comment=Hierarchical note organizer with rich text capabilities, syntax highlighting and data storage in a single XML or SQLite file.

O nome original em Inglês foi mantido, eu incluí duas ou três palavras antes ou depois do nome, este recurso pode fazer muita diferença quando um usuário olha o menu e lê o que o CherryTree faz ou se propõe a fazer.

O comentário precisa ter mais informações, precisa ter mais detalhes e informações. Se alguma informação do texto estiver errada, será muito bem-vinda todas as melhorias necessárias, eu construí este texto com pesquisas que eu fiz na internet, pode ser que esteja errado o comentário.

[Forum Admin Dave]

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Here is a copy of a discussion I had with BobC.

It would be best to collect translations.
When you have a good amount of translations, make a list of what packages the .desktop files came from.
This can be found out with the command:dpkg -S /usr/share/applications/*.desktop
Then run: apt show package-name-here
to get the information on the package (who packaged it, where the code is, how to submit code changes, etc) and submit the change to the project and/or the package maintainer. In most cases you could probably link to the repository with all your updated .desktop file in an email to the package maintainer listed in the apt show output. However if they do not maintain / update the .desktop file they are not likely going to forward it on the the project. If it is a debian package, you can alternatively find the information on where to submit the changes or who to contact from the tracker here. https://tracker.debian.org

There are also the tools: desktop-file-edit, desktop-file-install, and desktop-file-validate which may come of use.

Computers are like air conditioners. They work fine until you start opening Windows. ~Author Unknown

[Member Robin]

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Many thanks, Dave, for pointing us to these tools, I didn’t know them. When reading the man page I get the impression this tool doesn’t handle localisations of the original entries at all. Maybe I’m not understanding correctly, but it looks to me, all what this tool can do is to remove all the localisations once you try to fix a single colon in the original entry:

--set-name=NAME
        Set the name (key Name) to NAME. If a name was already set, it will be overridden. Localizations of the old name will be removed

--set-generic-name=GENERIC-NAME
        Set the generic name (key GenericName) to GENERIC-NAME. If a generic name was already set, it will be overridden. Localizations of  the old generic name will be removed.

--set-comment=COMMENT
        Set the comment (key Comment) to COMMENT. If a comment was already set, it will be overridden. Localizations of the old comment will be removed.

If this turns out to be true, this is not suitable at all. We need to keep the translated entries rather than removing them, when applying minor fixes to an original entry which don’t change its meaning, so all the translations are still fine.

Windows is like a submarine. Open a window and serious problems will start.

[Member marcelocripe]

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I had a hard time following the other thread on video reviews that went in many directions.

In fact, they are different topics dealing with the same subject, how the communication between developers/programmers and the end user can be improved or how to make antiX more didactic.
This is not a problem unique to antiX, other distributions have the same communication problem, the end user spends a lot of time guessing what each program does just by reading the menu, because he doesn’t know what the program does or what it’s for.

One question I had been instead of a place in /usr/share would /usr/local be a better place for the specific changed files?

I think a folder with the .desktop files could be stored in the /usr/share/antiX folder, this folder is where the anticapitalista keeps the antiX help files.

I like the idea of ​​a post install script or package to revert any apt/synaptic changes from upstream.

Dave and BobC started to develop a script that allows you to enable and disable comments in menus. I helped to test and managed to create two .desktop files, one to enable and one to disable comments in menus. I really liked what I saw and I think soon more people will be able to help test the script.

Also I agree with keeping the original package name, just changing the generic and comments.

Sorry, this sentence I couldn’t understand.

Is it possible to edit them on Gitlab and hitting replace?
I’m already a member on there.

It is possible to make merge requests, but anything that is changed (edited) in GitLab must also be in Transifex.
We need native English speakers (en_GB, en_US, etc.) including Transifex. I was able to teach Spartak77 how to merge on GitLab because it allowed to share your screen images through a video call we had on 2022-04-24.

To facilitate communication for teaching this procedure or any other, we need to communicate through HexChat and with Robin’s machine translation program, because I can’t write and read in English. Thanks to Robin’s program, I write in my language and the person receives automatic translation in their language.

– – – – –

I had a hard time following the other thread on video reviews that went in many directions.

Na verdade, são tópicos diferentes tratando do mesmo assunto, de como a comunicação entre os desenvolvedores/programadores e o usuário final pode ser melhorada ou como tornar o antiX mais didático.
Este não é um problema exclusivo do antiX, as outras distribuições possuem o mesmo problema de comunicação, o usuário final perde muito tempo tentando adivinhar o que cada programa faz apenas lendo no menu, porque não sabe o que o programa faz ou para que serve.

One question I had was instead of a place in /usr/share would /usr/local be a better place for the specific changed files?

Eu acho que poderia ser armazenada uma pasta com os arquivos .desktop na pasta /usr/share/antiX, esta pasta é onde o anticapitalista mantém os arquivos de ajuda do antiX.

I like the idea of a post install script or package to revert any apt/synaptic changes from upstream.

O Dave e o BobC começaram a desenvolver um script que permite ativar e desativar os comentários nos menus. Eu ajudei a testar e consegui criar dois arquivos .desktop, um para ativar e ou outro para desativar os comentários nos menus. Eu gostei muito do que vi e acho que em breve mais pessoas poderão ajudar a testar o script.

Also I agree with keeping the original package name, just changing the generic and comments.

Perdão, este frase eu não consegui compreender.

Is it possible to edit them on Gitlab and hitting replace?
I’m already a member on there.

É possível fazer pedidos de mesclagem, mas tudo que for alterado (editado) no GitLab precisa também estar no Transifex.
Nós precisamos de nativos do idioma Inglês (en_GB, en_US, etc.) inclusive no Transifex. Eu consegui ensinar ao Spartak77 a fazer mesclagem no GitLab porque ele permitiu compartilhar as imagens da sua tela por meio de uma chamada de vídeo que fizemos no dia 24-04-2022.

Para facilitar a comunicação para o ensino deste procedimento ou de qualquer outro, nós precismos nos comunicar por meio do HexChat e com o programa de tradução automática do Robin, porque eu não sei escrever e ler em Inglês. Graças ao programa do Robin, eu escrevo em meu idioma e a pessoa recebe a tradução automática no seu idioma.

[Moderator BobC]

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I went through all the ones Marcelo sent and tried to make sure that if the name didn’t say what the program did that there was a generic name with a few words of description. I sent it back to Marcelo, who had given it to me to improve the English descriptions.

[Member marcelocripe]

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I’m starting this thread for discussing what changes, ideas, and corrections
would help with translating the desktop file comments and generic names for
new users and users in other countries.

We need to point out that the antiX update that took place on April 24, 2022 already impacted users, as can be seen in the first topic of Teotonio, where he was startled by the amount of texts in English that appeared in the Applications submenus in an antiX installed in Brazilian Portuguese. This happened because several .desktop files do not have the entry Name[pt_BR]= , GenericName[pt_BR]= and Comment[pt_BR]=.

What are these….. modified .desktop files for all the preinstalled antixFull /usr/share/applications files?
How will these be deployed? Added to a future package version of “desktop-defaults-antix” [[[ or ? “desktop-menu-antix” ]]]

Iznit, the .desktop files are in the /usr/share/applications folder and in the /usr/share/applications/antix folder, where the entry Name[pt_BR]= is displayed in the antiX menu started in Brazilian Portuguese, the entry Name[fr_BE]= is displayed in the antiX menu started in Belgian French, the entry Name[de]= is displayed in the antiX menu started in German and so on. When there is no language entry (de, pt, fr, it, etc) or the language entry plus the country identifier (de_BE, pt_BR, fr_BE, fr_CA, etc.) Name= which is normally in English language. But which English language? There are several English languages ​​spoken in several countries besides Great Britain and the United States of America.

That’s why we need native English language (en_GB, en_US, etc.) including in Transifex contribs.

@marcelocripe, your English comment on cherrytree application on the other post makes it a lot clearer in English for users that are not familiar with it.

This text template I have been implementing since August 2020 when I started the revisions and corrections of the Brazilian Portuguese translations. It’s nothing more than making what the program does understandable, since translating the program’s name will not make any sense in my language. Another example that communication is perfect, even with automatic translation is from the “IceWM Toolbar Icon Manager” menu, the end user immediately understands what it means.
If this model is approved, it will be necessary for at least one native of each variant of the English language to review the entry corresponding to their language Name=, Name[en_GB]=, Name[en_US]=, etc.

It’s great to see that Robin and Dave have already arrived at this topic.

– – – – –

I’m starting this thread for discussing what changes, ideas, and corrections
would help with translating the desktop file comments and generic names for
new users and users in other countries.

Nós precisamos destacar que na atualização do antiX que ocorreu no dia 24 de abril de 2022 já impactaram os usuários, como pode ser observado no primeiro tópico do Teotonio, onde ele se assustou com a quantidade de textos em idioma Inglês que apareceram nos submenus Aplicativos em um antiX instalado em idioma Português do Brasil. Isso aconteceu porque vários arquivos .desktop não possuem a entrada Name[pt_BR]= , GenericName[pt_BR]= e Comment[pt_BR]=.

What are these….. modified .desktop files for all the preinstalled antixFull /usr/share/applications files?
How will these be deployed? Added to a future package version of “desktop-defaults-antix” [[[ or ? “desktop-menu-antix” ]]]

Iznit, os arquivos .desktop estão na pasta /usr/share/applications e na pasta /usr/share/applications/antix, onde a entrada Name[pt_BR]= é exibida no menu do antiX iniciado em idioma Português do Brasil, a entrada Name[fr_BE]= é exibida no menu do antiX iniciado em idioma Francês da Bélgica, a entrada Name[de]= é exibida no menu do antiX iniciado em idioma Alemão e assim sucessivamente. Quando não existe a entrada do idioma (de, pt, fr, it, etc) ou a entrada do idioma mais o identificador do país (de_BE, pt_BR, fr_BE, fr_CA, etc) o texto que será exibido será sempre é o da entrada Name= que normalmente está em idioma Inglês. Mas de qual idioma Inglês? Existem vários idiomas Inglês falado em diversos países além da Grã Bretanha e dos Estados Unidos da América.

É por isso que nós precisamos de nativos do idioma Inglês (en_GB, en_US, etc.) inclusive no Transifex contribs.

@marcelocripe, your English comment on cherrytree application on the other post makes it a lot clearer in English for users that are not familiar with it.

Este modelo de texto eu venho implementando desde agosto de 2020 quando eu iniciei as revisões e correções das traduções em Português do Brasil. Nada mais é do que tornar compreensível o que o programa faz, já que traduzir o nome do programa não fará sentido algum em meu idioma. Outro exemplo que a comunicação é perfeita, mesmo com a tradução automática é do menu do “IceWM Toolbar Icon Manager”, o usuário final compreende imediatamente o que significa.
Se este modelo for aprovado, será necessário que ao menos um nativo de cada variante do idioma Inglês faça a revisão na entrada correspondente ao seu idioma Name=, Name[en_GB]=, Name[en_US]=, etc.

É muito bem ver que o Robin e o Dave já chegaram neste tópico.

[Anonymous]

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Great work @BobC,

That’s what I can also help with too is the generic name and comment parts of the .desktop files in en_US to make
them clearer and more descriptive.

——————— original text in English ———————-

Grande trabalho @BobC,

Isso é o que eu também posso ajudar com o nome genérico e comentar partes dos arquivos .desktop em en_US para fazer
mais claros e mais descritivos.

[Member marcelocripe]

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That’s what I can also help with too is the generic name and comment parts of the .desktop files in en_US to make
them clearer and more descriptive.

Linuxdaddy, I invite you again to help us with the proofreading of texts in the en_US language. We need you and others who are interested running the changes in Transifex and then GitLab.

Linuxdaddy, you will have to join the Transifex en_US translation team.

For those who are natives of another language, even if it is English, join the language identifier translation team, if there is a country identifier, prefer the option with four letters or more that identifies the language and country.

Only native speakers of the language can easily identify any typos made by someone else or the need to improve the text when copying texts from .desktop files and pasting them into Transifex.

In this topic antiX and antiX Application Program Translation Platforms has a tutorial on how to register and URL addresses.

– – – – –

That’s what I can also help with too is the generic name and comment parts of the .desktop files in en_US to make
them clearer and more descriptive.

Linuxdaddy, eu te convido novamente a nos ajudar com a revisão dos textos em idioma en_US. Nós precisamos de você e das outras pessoas que estiverem interessadas executando as alterações no Transifex e depois no GitLab.

Linuxdaddy, você terá que entrar na equipe de tradução en_US do Transifex.

Para quem é nativo de outro idioma, mesmo que for do Inglês, entre na equipe de tradução do identificador do idioma, se houver o identificador do país, prefira a opção com quatro letras ou mais que identifique o idioma e o país.

Só quem é nativo do idioma consegue identificar facilmente qualquer eventual erro de digitação cometido por outra pessoa ou a necessidade de melhorar o texto, quando estiver copiando os textos dos arquivos .desktop e colando no Transifex.

Neste tópico antiX and antiX Application Program Translation Platforms possui um tutorial de como fazer o cadastro e os endereços de URL.

[Anonymous]

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Thank you so much @marcelocripe, I signed up for transifex and the antix-contribs and joined the en_us one.
Had a few minutes to look at a few.

——————————————————————–
Muito obrigado @marcelocripe, eu me inscrevi no transifex e no antix-contribs e me juntei ao en_us.
Tive alguns minutos para olhar para alguns.

[Member PPC]

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I have not that much free time to help with this .desktop files, but I noticed this- on my antiX 19 system, (localized in pt) “Android Device USB Connect” comes up in English, as does “antiX Wifi Switch“, “Chroot Rescue Scan” (a hard entry to localize), “date and Time“.
The 3 menu entries related to persistence, that where excellent in the previous version, are now back to their original (and to me, confusing) original versions, although they come up localized…

P.

[Member marcelocripe]

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The 3 menu entries related to persistence, that where excellent in the previous version, are now back to their original (and to me, confusing) original versions, although they come up localized…

PPC, so the update that took place recently lost the latest texts that had already been worked on by Zeh and I at the end of the year 2021. Please, when you have some free time, check that the texts are correct in en in Transifex contris and in GitLab contribs.
In addition to the problems mentioned by Teotonio, there are now others of outdated text in .desktop files that you noticed.

Thank you so much @marcelocripe, I signed up for transifex and the antix-contribs and joined the en_us one.
Had a few minutes to look at a few.

Thank you for joining the antiX volunteer translator team.
You can compare the original text with the interpretations of other languages ​​that were made by humans of the following languages: fr, fr_BE, de, it, pt and pt_BR, in some programs we had the hands of a good human being in the es language. I hope he or she returns to our team. Any text that is in your language and is not understandable by you, I understand that you can edit at will and this will benefit all other languages ​​in the long run.

– – – – –

The 3 menu entries related to persistence, that where excellent in the previous version, are now back to their original (and to me, confusing) original versions, although they come up localized…

PPC, então a atualização que ocorreu recentemente perdeu os textos mais recentes que já haviam sido trabalhados pelo Zeh e eu no final do ano de 2021. Por favor, quando você tiver um tempo livre, verifique se os textos estão corretos em pt no Transifex contris e no GitLab contribs.
Além dos problemas mencionados pelo Teotonio, agora existem outros de desatualização dos textos dos arquivos .desktop que foi percebido por você.

Thank you so much @marcelocripe, I signed up for transifex and the antix-contribs and joined the en_us one.
Had a few minutes to look at a few.

Eu agradeço por você se juntar a equipe de tradutores voluntários do antiX.
Você pode comparar o texto original com as interpretações de outros idiomas que foram feitos por seres humanos dos seguinte idiomas: fr, fr_BE, de, it, pt e pt_BR, em alguns programas tivemos as mãos de um bom ser humano no idioma es. Eu espero que ele ou ela retorne à nossa equipe. Qualquer texto que estiver em seu idioma e que não seja compreensível por você, eu entento que você pode editar à vontade e isso beneficiará a longo prazo todos os outros idiomas.

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