[antiX-sid users only]Do not upgrade (1 March 2024)!

Forum Forums News Sid Upgraders [antiX-sid users only]Do not upgrade (1 March 2024)!

  • This topic has 75 replies, 8 voices, and was last updated May 1-8:18 am by Xunzi_23.
Viewing 15 posts - 31 through 45 (of 76 total)
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  • #136978
    Moderator
    Brian Masinick

      @Robin you are QUITE correct! The sidux distribution, after some turmoil, was indeed continued as aptosid;
      by that time my friends also departed from any association with that team.

      You are also correct that siduction is now the name of the current distribution. Those are the very same people, without a doubt, who worked on both sidux and aptosid, as well as siduction. The most recent release that I am aware of was released on August 162023 – the Release Notes mention 2023.1.0 “Standing on the Shoulders of Giants”, and there is a huge turtle; previous version was the Masters of War release.

      Good software; it’s not worth raising any controversial anything in their forum; I stay clear of that place.

      --
      Brian Masinick

      #136990
      Member
      Robin

        you are QUITE correct!

        Have fixed that in the above posting. I actually meant the release date, not the release name, and I took the value from the wikipedia lemmata linked. Have not been at their forums for many years meanwhile. But I really liked their tool they used to have in IRC, wasn’t it called “aynoS“, providing all kind of useful factoids when starting a line with an exclamation mark and putting the item you wanted details about behind it? Wish I could figure how to run such factoid thing in the antiX-translators channel. Could answer all kind of FAQ about the antiX translations, how to do this or that properly.

        [Edit: No, probably I was wrong: aynoS was kanotix IRC if I’m not mistaken. But can’t recollect anymore whether the one or the other. Or was it both?]

        Windows is like a submarine. Open a window and serious problems will start.

        #136991
        Forum Admin
        anticapitalista

          https://siduction.org/2011/08/why-we-fork-aptosid/

          for those interested in the roots of siduction.

          Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

          antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

          #136992
          Forum Admin
          anticapitalista

            sid is still undergoing massive changes so the advice is not to do any upgrades.

            Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

            antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

            #136996
            Member
            Robin

              for those interested in the roots of siduction.

              Yes, remember this. Was also tired of all the censoring taking place in the sidux/aptosid universe when I was running sidux on my notebook many years ago, after kanotix had changed its base from sid to debian stable.

              Btw, their forums seem still (as in the old days) to be a (if not the) place to look at when running SID, for warnings and also hints about what workarounds exist for these, when or when not to safely upgrade, even when not running siduction: frequent SID upgrade-warnings

              Windows is like a submarine. Open a window and serious problems will start.

              #136998
              Forum Admin
              anticapitalista

                IMO siduction devs were the ‘good’ guys in the split from aptosid.
                aptosid was a very hostile/arrogant place overall (Obviously not all the dev team/members).
                sidux was great at the beginning.
                I even thought of basing antiX off it at one point.

                Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

                antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

                #137005
                Moderator
                Brian Masinick

                  https://siduction.org/2011/08/why-we-fork-aptosid/

                  for those interested in the roots of siduction.

                  Thank you very much for that excellent piece of history.

                  It’s reassuring.

                  --
                  Brian Masinick

                  #137008
                  Member
                  stevesr0

                    UPDATE.

                    mpv IS working (both from the command line and in X from the terminal. The failure to find the file came because the filename in zzzfm displayed in the window is incomplete(04. Dindi.ogg); in the frame below the window, it is listed properly as 0.4.Dindi.ogg. When I started mpv with the correct filename, it plays fine. N.B. In the interim, I did upgrade a package that mpv depends upon (libdvdnav4) so I can’t guarantee that that wasn’t also necessary (without reverting it (which I won’t do at the moment.)

                    Hi all,

                    Warning for Siddites.

                    I accidentally upgraded to a debian version of mpv (0.37) which is more recent than the latest antix1 version (0.32). Several library packages required by the antix version are no longer available, so I can’t force revert to the antix version.

                    The problem for anyone trying to avoid systemd is that the upgraded version is indirectly (thru a dependency of libpipewire-0.3-0t64 on a version of libspa-0.2-modules) dependent on libsystemd0.

                    Aargh.

                    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by stevesr0.
                    • This reply was modified 3 months ago by stevesr0.
                    #137010
                    Moderator
                    Brian Masinick

                      Hi all,

                      Warning for Siddites.

                      I accidentally upgraded to a debian version of mpv (0.37) which is more recent than the latest antix1 version (0.32). Several library packages required by the antix version are no longer available, so I can’t force revert to the antix version.

                      The problem for anyone trying to avoid systemd is that the upgraded version is indirectly (thru a dependency of libpipewire-0.3-0t64 on a version of libspa-0.2-modules) dependent on libsystemd0.

                      Aargh.

                      Suppose you get rid of that package.
                      How many other packages would also have to be changed?

                      Since this system is your “fun” system and/or your experiment, are you willing to try something really different and back out that package in order to get the antiX one?

                      Maybe you could try the apt option where you check out the change without actually performing it or “go wild” and “Just Do It!”

                      Your thoughts?

                      By the way, when I have had multiple systems to experiment with, I have done such things. Sometimes they work and other times the system breaks. What’s cool with trying is that you start to get an appreciation for what is possible and what definitely will not work!

                      --
                      Brian Masinick

                      #137035
                      Forum Admin
                      anticapitalista

                        sid is still undergoing massive changes so the advice is not to do any upgrades.

                        This applies to ‘fun’ installs too 🙂

                        Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

                        antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

                        #137050
                        Member
                        stevesr0

                          anticapitalista said

                          “This applies to ‘fun’ installs too <happy face>”

                          Yup, understood. Doing this may ruin my toy.

                          It is just troubling to me as the upgradables pile up in the hundreds- hard to believe I will ever catch up <g>.

                          Mainly it is an opportunity to understand the dependencies and interlinking nature of the beast.

                          #137080
                          Moderator
                          Brian Masinick

                            @stevesr0 in the case of Sid, if you are not upgrading nearly every week (if not daily), within two weeks to a month, an upgrade is almost equivalent to a complete re-installation. At the present time, it doesn’t look like it’s possible to get a complete Sid-based system that is also nosystemD without it being a month or more in age. That’s not terrible, but to me, a true Sid and a true antiX, at least at the present time, appear to be mutually exclusive.

                            So if you want to upgrade it without regard to antiX, it’ll be more like siduction than antiX in one or two updates! The only stuff that might stay antiX would be the appearance items, a few of the kernels and some of the tools that don’t get completely replaced.

                            If I were running your system, I’d have an old snapshot image available, from which it’d be possible to “retreat” to something worthy of an antiX label, then I’d go crazy, letting in the systemD poison and see how well or how poorly it performs. On my more powerful systems, stuff with systemD work fine, but I have only one right now – MX Linux 23.2 AHS, which is an excellent system with quite a few tools common with antiX; but it definitely is NOT systemD free!

                            --
                            Brian Masinick

                            #137081
                            Member
                            stevesr0

                              Hi Brian,

                              Thanks for wise advice.

                              I should practice using iso-snapshots for backups.

                              (My feeelings about systemd are completely “religious” – I like the notion of one-tool for one task and the systemd approach destroys that in my (untutuored) view. So it doesn’t matter to me if systemd systems are much better by some criteria.)

                              • This reply was modified 3 months ago by stevesr0.
                              #137087
                              Forum Admin
                              anticapitalista

                                The issue in sid at the moment is not related to systemd.
                                All packages are being rebuilt due to t_time transition.
                                In fact all packages are being rebuilt and a few days later rebuilt again so it is pointless for antiX to rebuild our nosystemd packages every 3 or 4 days only for them to need repackaging again due to upstream changes.

                                All sid users including those running systemd (eg siduction) are advised to wait.

                                • This reply was modified 3 months ago by anticapitalista. Reason: fix typos

                                Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

                                antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

                                #137098
                                Member
                                stevesr0

                                  Hi anticapitalista,

                                  Point taken.

                                  It does worry me that so many packages are being revised that if I wait until the situation has stabilized, there will be so many interdependencies created that upgrading will be a very complex task to complete successfully and remain nosystemd free.

                                  Yes, you certainly have a much clearer understanding of this than I <g>, and your advice is wise.

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