DUR Debian User Repository

[Member ModdIt]

MOVED, POST from PPC

@Moddit: I never used any arch based distro, but I’ve always curious about their AUR. A few months ago, DUR, the same for Debian based distros appeared, but since then seems to have vanished from the face of the internet 🙁
Fortunately, it seems to have been replaced by https://mpr.hunterwittenborn.com/

Source:
https://www.linuxcompatible.org/story/debian-user-repository-dur-launched/

P.

[Member ModdIt]

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Thanks PPC, I had thought the DUR project was dead, it is for sure not an easy task to recreate or replicate the arch setup and AUR helpers.

Maybe a bit of info regarding AUR for readers:
AUR is a community software repository for Arch Linux users, it which contains PKGBUILDs, a toolbox set of script or scripts for users to compile and build packages from the source code. Sometimes the packages are alpha or early versions up for trial and testing, sometimes forks, often Niche packages, things considered too unimportant for sufficient users and as such do not enter the main repository. Later if popular that can and does change.

AUR helpers are perhaps best described as extensions to the package manager, pacman in Arch and arch based distributions. pacman can be described as the Arch Apt although it is somewhat different. Commands are as compact as possible, something which we can setup in bash aliases. I could fully update with sudo pacman -syyu for example.
There are several Popular AUR helpers, for those interested pls do a quick search. Better than we blow up the thread.

Please keep discussion on topic DUR Debian user Repository .
Wish to talk about Arch or Arch based, Other distros is the place for that.

[Member Xecure]

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Debian’s response to this initiative was very negative:

https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2021/07/msg00031.html
On 2021/07/02 19:16, Stephan Lachnit wrote:
> Today I discovered a relatively new project called “Debian User Repository” [1].

For what it’s worth, the Debian trademark team is already aware of this.

-Jonathan

They forced the creator to change the name:

https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2021/07/msg00029.html
[…]
It mainly *targets* Ubuntu, but there’s no reason it wouldn’t be functional on Debian distributions. Dependencies can be listed for both distros through makedeb’s release-specific dependency functionality [1], allowing the DUR’s (as stated before, I’m open to changing the name) PKGBUILDs to work and provide for any number of systems.
[…]

and they (Debian) wanted no part with it at all.

I am really not interested in a system like AUR, which provides instructions to download the source and BUILD the packages, installing lots of build dependencies that bloats the OS. I would have preferred a contribs repository where people could upload already prepared packages, so that we don’t need to add lots of sources or PPAs to the system to be able to install the packages I need. Just adding one source (the contribs repo), with the corresponding release (bullseye, testing, sid…) and an option for free, non-free and experimental categories, would make Debian a much better place for us, Debian users. But the Debian leaders have no interest in this (nor in a Debian AUR), and only want maintainers (which need to be promoted and selected by them, from members with a long time contributing to Debian) instead of a “wild west” community of contributions.

If anyone wants something similar to AUR, that builds packages from source, they don’t need any DUR or similar. Simply study how to install NIX in antiX and build and install the packages from there.

antiX Live system enthusiast.
General Live Boot Parameters for antiX.

[Member PPC]

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I never used DUR, I just browsed at the homepage, trying to get a feel for it. For me, an almost ideal equivalent of “AUR” would be a place that housed appimage latest version of applications, so users can test/use them without risking any harm to their systems.
As an example, I would like the see a webpage that offered a mix of https://www.appimagehub.com/ https://www.pling.com https://g.srev.in/get-appimage/categories/ https://apprepo.de/ into one searchable “Store like” place.
Users can configure spacefm/zzzfm to automaticaly change permissions and run appimages, so literally it’s just download and click to run ( like in MacOS)
Pros: a perfectly safe way to use the latest version of many hundreds of apps. Appimages can be added to the menus using several methods.
Cons: appimages may be huge because they include almost 100% of the needed dependencies. Manually extracting appgimages (for faster access) can mean some work, mainly creating a .desktop file, so it’s easier to run the application. File associations with appimages can sometimes be problematic

P.

[Member ModdIt]

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Debian’s response to this initiative was very negative: My response to debian too, the present debian leaders are too busy crowing about their greatness to see anything else.
For a long time I WAS a donator to debian, System D, legal actions and threats, user input unwanted. As a user I felt unwanted.
At that time I mailed to Philipp Müller, got a sane, polite answer, same goes for anticapitalista. Mail to debian devs, ignored, will not fix, blame other maintainer other hogwash..

In the past I built a lot of packages from AUR, some with helper some without. My Play/learn and experiment system was separate, from needed for more serious stuff Just dual booted, second system on a separate disk and my first root and home no mountpoints, no automount.
Not all aur packages are stable, some I looked at and abandoned, some were good and used on main setup. Many packages move from AUR in to main repo.

Regarding bloatdevelopment packages fills the disk, that is userland. My 256GB SDD comes at 25 Euro Cent per GB current amazon price. I do not care at a bit more space used. The box also has a 1 Terabyte rotating disk, Im likely dead before that is full even when I would use my Nikon for raw images a lot.

If I had my netbook in mind with its wimpy processor and 1GB mem, for some a luxury device I would think differently.

Its all relative to user needs and wishes, nobody here clamouring to blow up the distro to the proportions of many other so called lightweight systems.
The image setup for university students is at present 6GB plus, has what they need for home study and some more for relaxation.

I built some packages for our local antiX, like to know how to do these things. I built live from a 64 GB stick on my Quad core with for me luxury 8GB Ram cache to an ssd, takes time but works..

Appimages are useful but can be huge and still depend on system packages, or are compiled with specific processor flags. See ungoogled chromium for that,
I only think they are safe, as far as I can judge that is, when I have a checksum and have taken a look in the package. I then run the application but No network connection to see where they try and connect to.Can be interesting, disconcerting.

Just saw firefox on appimage hub, download from Mozilla, unpack, it runs anywhere as a portable application on 64 bit systems. Said appimage is 64 bit and extremely outdated. MMMM

• This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by ModdIt.
• This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by ModdIt.

[Member PPC]

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Dated (and thus less secure) apps is always a risk when running stuff not from the official producer/maintainer… In Firefox’s case, you may try https://apprepo.de/appimage/firefox
Apprepo is my place of choice for appimages of browsers and office suits- 2 essential tools…

P.

[Member oparun]

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In case of Firefox/Thunderbird you can download them from official sites, unpack them and move to /opt.

[Member ModdIt]

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Thanks PPC but as oparun says, fox is better downloaded from the official site if you need an updated version, it is portable.
I do not even move it to opt, unpack, remove the hidden extensions then move to a dotfile in home. Rename, to what I like.
Create a starter. Job done. Update, just delete folder contents, copy in new version. set start
permission to execute.

Renaming was a suggestion from Skidoo, respawn scripts are way more likely to fail as they look for official name.

• This reply was modified 1 year, 4 months ago by ModdIt.

[Member blur13]

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Debian is known for stability, it seems like DUR would be anathema to that, so I can understand Debians point of view. If a user would like the latest packages then Arch is a good distro. Personally I prefer debian stable with a few key packages compiled from source to be “the latest”. Although then I guess its not really stable anymore 🙂

Trade offs, trade offs, trade offs…

[Member ModdIt]

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Interesting is if you are on Arch or Arch based the argument against AUR is stability, same as put to discussion here.
The big but is Installing software form other sources or self compiling are user choices.

Note what you install, better not a big bundle of unsupported applications at once, that makes finding troublesome packages a pain.

Get desktop freezing, do you have ungoogled chromium installed, common culprit due cache or config corruption. Libreoffice Fresh and Debian Java. Debian java is buggy (known lt devs fixed next release) and not in the LO approved list it can cause hard to diagnose issues. LO approval maybe after a bugfixed java release.

As blur 13 wrote trade offs, user choices.

PPC gave a number of links for appimages, Personal opinion is if software can be downloaded from the original source as a deb it is better to do so. Firefox, all versions portable from Mozilla, plus debs from repos. Opera, Vivaldi, debs available. Libreoffice Fresh Backported debs or if java is really important from LO org. Deb packages easily installable with dpkg. Softmaker, packet installer or direct from softmaker site, debs and instructions available.
For packages which are only available as appimage and have checksums, I like to look in the package then try them on an isolated system before using on my main device.

An equivalent to AUR, I would certainly use it knowing the advantages can be outweighed by problems. Big but there is we have a fantastic live system on a stick available, best playground or testing area possible.

I used AUR quite a lot, had way less less trouble than with systemD, crazy waits for shutdown, sticking boot process and non recoverable update fails which were a plague for a while. Not to mention that if you wanted to remove some seemingly unimportant application like a music player the d madness would also wipe out your desktop. Real experience, it was, i guess still is lunatic.

[Member subluminal]

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Arch is awesome. But I don’t install packages from AUR unless I absolutely must. In the past, that meant about 5-8 packages. When in Debian I also use deb-multimedia, in MX I don’t need deb-multimedia. Either way, Vanilla Debian/MX/Antix and Arch/EndeavourOS are my 2 favourite distros . Only Ubuntu-based distro that I like is KDE Neon. But PPA ecosystem is even more of a security risk.

• This reply was modified 1 year, 1 month ago by subluminal.

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