How to use antiX on computers with a motherboard with SIS or VIA chipset

Forum Forums antiX-development Development How to use antiX on computers with a motherboard with SIS or VIA chipset

  • This topic has 122 replies, 18 voices, and was last updated Jul 5-4:54 pm by seaken64.
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  • #45934
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    PPC
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    @linuxdaddy- even on those old machines, doesn’t smtube allow you to view Youtube videos with at least 360p (and, with some luck 460p, which is very nice, and ideal for most videos)
    Also, you can try using mpv to view youtube videos directly (setting the correct video drive and frame skip, if needed)

    Example:
    mpv –ytdl-format=”bestvideo[height<=?480][vcodec!=vp9]+bestaudio/best” [youtube_video_link]

    P.

    #45959
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    Xecure
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    Thanks for the advice, linuxdaddy. I am trying to figure out how the xorg.conf stuff is generated, and it seems to be a bit of hardware specific, so I am not sure how to make it so that xorg boots with 24-bit depth. I will keep investigating.

    Thank you very much for the tests and finding a solution to the visual artifacts.

    antiX Live system enthusiast.
    General Live Boot Parameters for antiX.

    #45961
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    Brian Masinick
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    FreeBSD has some steps, though I am not positive that every step is identical on a Linux distribution.
    https://www.freebsd.org/doc/en_US.ISO8859-1/books/handbook/x-config.html

    The Xorg site provides some information that may be useful, particularly if you have the need to create the xorg.conf file manually.
    Long ago, you always had to either create the file yourself unless your distribution was good enough to create it for you based on your hardware configuration.
    https://www.x.org/releases/X11R7.5/doc/man/man5/xorg.conf.5.html

    I hope this is helpful.

    Brian Masinick

    #45962
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    Brian Masinick
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    https://www.cyberciti.biz/faq/howto-linux-configure-xorg-x11/ is another resource if necessary.

    Brian Masinick

    #45970
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    thanks Brian,

    for the moment I bookmarked them to look later. I found one sis driver on github
    and downloaded it to try and do a build against current gcc on xecure iso. It hasn’t
    been updated since ubuntu 13 though.

    @xecure … you’re welcome. It might be a way to use these old chips on X until look
    into better options. in a few days I will upload my xorg.conf file so others can try
    it. but it’s for an actual after install on hdd.
    On the antix-19.3 live these chips are not use able.

    A few thoughts for true freedom ......
    1: Where ever there is greed and selfishness, evil will always smile upon.
    2: Wherever there is sharing of ideas and caring, good prevails and thrives.
    I'll fight for the second thought before joining or doing for the first.
    A thought, quote and belief of yours truly : from Linuxdaddy.

    #45989
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    Xecure
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    I see that there is an initrd script that can handle the creation of xorg.conf files based on boot parameters xorg=<options>, but I am not confident in being able to add a different option there for xorg=depth24. initrd is SO big and has so many files I get lost.
    Maybe I could create a script that a user could run in the live environment to create the xorg.conf file (similar to how MX linux does it to fix screen tearing) in the correct place, and maybe I would have to kill slim, kill xorg and then start slim again. I am also not confident in this and would need to read, plan and test a lot before including something so dangerous.

    I will try a few things but probably will give up.
    Does anyone have any ideas?

    antiX Live system enthusiast.
    General Live Boot Parameters for antiX.

    #45990
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    Brian Masinick
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    In the early days X did not have any automatic detection of hardware. Much has changed and it’s much easier to get a system working. Back then it was mandatory to read and learn or even get into the code to figure it out. Some geeks preferred it that way, fewer people and fewer questions.

    I was on the other side, a geek who wanted to create tools and systems that were usable for most people. In this regard I was among the pioneers. I did very little development but I was in more than one systems engineering group that wrote specifications for requirements.

    Brian Masinick

    #45997
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    Brian Masinick
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    I see that there is an initrd script that can handle the creation of xorg.conf files based on boot parameters xorg=<options>, but I am not confident in being able to add a different option there for xorg=depth24. initrd is SO big and has so many files I get lost.
    Maybe I could create a script that a user could run in the live environment to create the xorg.conf file (similar to how MX linux does it to fix screen tearing) in the correct place, and maybe I would have to kill slim, kill xorg and then start slim again. I am also not confident in this and would need to read, plan and test a lot before including something so dangerous.

    I will try a few things but probably will give up.
    Does anyone have any ideas?

    I think that the best way to start is to understand every possible option, so completely understand what is available on the Xorg site references that are earlier in the thread.

    After that I suspect that there are a few programs or scripts already available, so I would check to see what is freely available next.

    Third, see if the existing work solves all problems and then determine if it’s light and compatible with our software and finally create a design plan for the work. I may be able to help write specifications. I think that you are much better than me in actually coding the solution.

    Let me know what you think of the approach.

    Understanding what is needed and what is available may save a lot of time and eliminate any redundant efforts and it will also help to determine if a separate work is needed.

    Brian Masinick

    #45998
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    Brian Masinick
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    I will also look into my archive and see if I have any old Xorg.conf configuration files that can be used as a template or an example for VESA, VGA, or whatever I may still have, if anything.

    If I can find something I will be happy to share it.

    Brian Masinick

    #46003
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    Brian Masinick
    #46004
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    Xecure
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    Thanks, Mr. Masinick.
    I think I will follow your advice and not complicate myself.
    The default easy way to create a xorg.conf file is first running:
    sudo Xorg :1 -configure
    which will create a file in /root/xorg.conf.new with the system’s X11 hardware related configuration. From there I can copy only the parts I need for the display with Depth 24 and the video driver to a new xorg file in /ect/X11/xorg.conf
    After that, doing
    sudo X -config /etc/X11/xorg.conf
    Should help see if this new configuration works.

    I am not sure I will include the script until I really understand the minimum required information needed for an Xorg.conf file to work.

    antiX Live system enthusiast.
    General Live Boot Parameters for antiX.

    #46005
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    Brian Masinick
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    What you suggested will probably generate a file that has as much or more details than anything I may have in my archive and I agree with the approach.

    Great start!

    Brian Masinick

    #46014
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    marcelocripe
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    Xecure wrote:
    For those, marcelocripe, follow linuxdaddy’s advice and load them on safe video mode (to use the vesa driver) and see if they perform better than with the vesa driver on antiX 19.3.

    Test on the computer that has the Gigabyte GA-8S661FXM-775 motherboard, using the ISO “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” and starting in “Safe Video Mode”

    In “Boot options”: quiet splasht disable = lx nomodeset xorg = safe

    Desktop: Rox-IceWM

    demo @ antix1: ~
    $ inxi -G
    Graphics:
    Device-1: Silicon Integrated Systems [SiS] 661/741/760 PCI / AGP or 662 / 761Gx PCIE VGA Display Adapter
    driver: N / A
    Display: x11 server: X.Org 1.16.4 driver: vesa resolution: 1024 × 768 ~ 61Hz
    OpenGL: renderer: llvmpipe (LLVM 7.0 128 bits) v: 3.3 Table 18.3.6

    The menu images do not disappear as they do when you start in normal mode, only once the submenus of the “Applications” menu have become disorganized or out of the normal order. After I clicked “Update the Menu”, they were all organized and in the normal order. I noticed that the response of the left mouse click is difficult, it takes time for antiX to receive the command. The “Synaptic Package Manager” is not displayed in the “System” submenu. Using the menu “Select the Application” or “Control Center”, in System, clicking on “Synaptic Package Manager”, opens the program “Application Manager via Terminal” in English “Command line apt-based package manager”.

    Test on the computer that has the Asus P5V800-MX motherboard and VIA graphics card, using the ISO “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” and starting in “Safe Video Mode”

    In “Boot options”: quiet splasht disable = lx nomodeset xorg = safe

    Desktop: Rox-IceWM

    demo @ antix1: ~
    $ inxi -G
    Graphics:
    Device-1: VIA CN700 / P4M800 Pro / P4M800 CE / VN800 Graphics [S3 UniChrome Pro]
    driver: N / A
    Display: x11 server: X.Org 1.16.4 driver: vesa resolution: 1024×768 ~ N / A
    OpenGL: renderer: llvmpipe (LLVM 7.0 128 bits) v: 3.1 Table 18.3.6

    The menu images do not disappear as they do when you start in normal mode, the submenus of the “Applications” menu are not displayed. After I clicked “Update the Menu”, it did not display the submenus of the “Applications” menu. In the terminal I again applied the PPC suggestion to use a command as an administrator (root) to allow updating the menu.

    $ sudo free {Enter}

    After applying the above command, I clicked on the “Update Menu” menu, the submenus of the “Applications” menu were displayed and they were all organized and in the normal order. Using the menu “Select the Application” or “Control Center”, in System, clicking on “Synaptic Package Manager”, opens the program “Application Manager via Terminal” in English “Command line apt-based package manager”.

    In the case of the Asus P5V800-MX motherboard, a detail that I found important, when antiX was booted in normal mode, the resolution was 800×600. When started with Safe Video Mode, the resolution was 1024×768.

    Test on the computer that has the ASUS P5S800-VM motherboard and SIS video card, using the ISO “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” and starting in “Safe Video Mode”

    In “Boot options”: quiet splasht disable = lx nomodeset xorg = safe

    Desktop: Rox-IceWM

    demo @ antix1: ~
    $ inxi -G
    Graphics:
    Device-1: Silicon Integrated Systems [SiS] 661/741/760 PCI / AGP or 662 / 761Gx PCIE VGA Display Adapter
    driver: N / A
    Display: x11 server: X.Org 1.16.4 driver: vesa resolution: 1024 × 768 ~ N / A
    OpenGL: renderer: llvmpipe (LLVM 7.0 128 bits) v: 3.3 Table 18.3.6

    The menu images do not disappear as they do when you start in normal mode, the sub-menus of the “Applications” menu are organized normally. The “Synaptic Package Manager” is not displayed in the “System” submenu. Using the “Select the Application” or “Control Center” menu, under System, clicking on “Synaptic Package Manager”, opens the “Application Manager via Terminal” program or in English “Command line apt-based package manager” .

    Linuxdaddy, I would like to know more to be able to help you both in the development, but unfortunately I do not understand several terms that you and Xecure use, such as: build-iso tool, make compilation (or I still don’t know how to do this) and other arguments.

    If there is a way to install with “vesa” and after installation always start with “vesa” I believe that it will no longer present the problems in the display of ISO menus “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” that occur in normal mode.

    I hope this information is useful.

    marcelocripe
    (Original text in Brazilian Portuguese)

    ———-

    Xecure wrote:
    For those, marcelocripe, follow linuxdaddy’s advice and load them on safe video mode (to use the vesa driver) and see if they perform better than with the vesa driver on antiX 19.3.

    Teste no computador que possui a placa~mãe Gigabyte GA-8S661FXM-775, utilizando a ISO “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” e inciando em “Modo de Vídeo Seguro”

    Em “Opções de inicialização”: quiet splasht disable=lx nomodeset xorg=safe

    Área de trabalho: Rox-IceWM

    demo@antix1:~
    $ inxi -G
    Graphics:
    Device-1: Silicon Integrated Systems [SiS] 661/741/760 PCI/AGP or 662/761Gx PCIE VGA Display Adapter
    driver: N/A
    Display: x11 server: X.Org 1.16.4 driver: vesa resolution: 1024×768~61Hz
    OpenGL: renderer: llvmpipe (LLVM 7.0 128 bits) v: 3.3 Mesa 18.3.6

    As imagens dos menus não desaparecem como acontece quando inicia no modo normal, apenas uma vez os submenus do menu “Aplicações” ficaram desorganizados ou fora da ordem normal. Após eu clicar em “Atualizar o Menu”, ficaram todos organizados e na ordem normal. Eu observei que a resposta do clique do botão esquerdo do mouse está difícil, demora para o antiX receber o comando. O “Gerenciador de Pacotes Synaptic” não é exibido no submenu “Sistema”. Utilizando o menu “Selecione o Aplicativo” ou o “Centro de Controle”, em Sistema, clicando em “Gerenciador de Pacotes Synaptic”, abre o programa “Gerenciador de Aplicativos via Terminal” em inglês “Command line apt-based package manager”.

    Teste no computador que possui a placa~mãe Asus P5V800-MX e placa de vídeo VIA, utilizando a ISO “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” e inciando em “Modo de Vídeo Seguro”

    Em “Opções de inicialização”: quiet splasht disable=lx nomodeset xorg=safe

    Área de trabalho: Rox-IceWM

    demo@antix1:~
    $ inxi -G
    Graphics:
    Device-1: VIA CN700/P4M800 Pro/P4M800 CE/VN800 Graphics [S3 UniChrome Pro]
    driver: N/A
    Display: x11 server: X.Org 1.16.4 driver: vesa resolution: 1024×768~N/A
    OpenGL: renderer: llvmpipe (LLVM 7.0 128 bits) v: 3.1 Mesa 18.3.6

    As imagens dos menus não desaparecem como acontece quando inicia no modo normal, os submenus do menu “Aplicações” não são exibidos. Após eu clicar em “Atualizar o Menu”, não exibiu os submenus do menu “Aplicações”. No terminal apliquei novamente a sugestão do PPC de usar um comando como administrador (root) para permitir a atualização do menu.

    $ sudo free {Enter}

    Após aplicar o comando acima, eu cliquei no menu “Atualizar o Menu”, os submenus do menu “Aplicações” forma exibidos e ficaram todos organizados e na ordem normal. Utilizando o menu “Selecione o Aplicativo” ou o “Centro de Controle”, em Sistema, clicando em “Gerenciador de Pacotes Synaptic”, abre o programa “Gerenciador de Aplicativos via Terminal” em inglês “Command line apt-based package manager”.

    No caso da placa~mãe Asus P5V800-MX, um detalhe que eu achei importante, quando o antiX foi inicializado com o modo normal, a resolução foi de 800×600. Com a inicialização com o Modo de Vídeo Seguro a resolução foi de 1024×768.

    Teste no computador que possui a placa~mãe ASUS P5S800-VM e placa de vídeo SIS, utilizando a ISO “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” e inciando em “Modo de Vídeo Seguro”

    Em “Opções de inicialização”: quiet splasht disable=lx nomodeset xorg=safe

    Área de trabalho: Rox-IceWM

    demo@antix1:~
    $ inxi -G
    Graphics:
    Device-1: Silicon Integrated Systems [SiS] 661/741/760 PCI/AGP or 662/761Gx PCIE VGA Display Adapter
    driver: N/A
    Display: x11 server: X.Org 1.16.4 driver: vesa resolution: 1024×768~N/A
    OpenGL: renderer: llvmpipe (LLVM 7.0 128 bits) v: 3.3 Mesa 18.3.6

    As imagens dos menus não desaparecem como acontece quando inicia no modo normal, os submenus do menu “Aplicações” estão organizados normalmente. O “Gerenciador de Pacotes Synaptic” não é exibido no submenu “Sistema”. Utilizando o menu “Selecione o Aplicativo” ou o “Centro de Controle”, em Sistema, clicando em “Gerenciador de Pacotes Synaptic”, abre o programa “Gerenciador de Aplicativos via Terminal” ou em inglês “Command line apt-based package manager”.

    Linuxdaddy, eu gostaria de conhecer mais para poder ajudar vocês dois no desenvolvimento, mas infelizmente eu não compreendo diversos termos que você e o Xecure utilizam, como por exemplo: ferramenta build-iso, fazer compilação (ou ainda não sei como fazer isso) e outros argumentos.

    Se houver um meio de instalar com o “vesa” e após a instalação sempre iniciar com “vesa” eu acredito que não apresentará mais os problemas na exibição dos menus da ISO “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” que ocorrem no modo normal.

    Eu espero que estas informações sejam úteis.

    marcelocripe
    (Texto original em Português do Brasil)

    #46017
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    Xecure
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    Thanks for the important feedback, marcelocripe.
    To summarize, your experience with the vesa driver was:
    – better resolution, no graphical glitches (no information about how it compared to previous performance) compared to the openchrome driver on VIA based machines.
    – No graphical glitches but worked a bit slower (slower response) compared to using the fbdev driver on SIS based machines.

    In more detail:
    1. Computer Gigabyte GA-8S661FXM-775 and SIS video chip.
    Before (with graphical glitches and fbdev driver):
    driver: fbdev resolution: 1024x768~N/A
    Now (no graphical glitches but slower response on vesa driver):
    driver: vesa resolution: 1024×768~61Hz

    2. Computer Asus P5V800-MX and VIA video chip.
    Before (smaller resolution but higher refresh rate, using openchrome driver):
    driver: openchrome resolution: 800x600~85Hz
    Now (higher resolution on vesa driver):
    driver: vesa resolution: 1024×768~N/A

    3. Computer ASUS P5S800-VM and SIS video chip.
    Before (fbdev driver, not sure if there are graphical glitches)
    – no inxi -G info (we asume similar to the other machine with SIS video chip).
    Now (No glitches, not sure about response speed, on vesa driver)
    driver: vesa resolution: 1024×768~N/A

    It would be good to know if using fbdev with 24 bits color depth as linuxdaddy suggests can improve the experience on SIS machines without changing to a vesa driver (mainly the icons that disappear issue, that will probably influence other strange graphical behaviors). If all SIS video chips have a slower response on vesa, maybe fbdev with proper color depth can have an improved experience. Or maybe if compiling with linuxdaddy’s suggested driver may be even better.

    “Centro de Controle”, em Sistema, clicando em “Gerenciador de Pacotes Synaptic”, abre o programa “Gerenciador de Aplicativos via Terminal” ou em inglês “Command line apt-based package manager”.

    This is normal. On antiX base, Synaptic package manager is not installed. What is wrong is the translated text for pt_BR. That button in the menu in English is “Manage Packages”, and will launch Synaptic Package Manager if it is installed. If it is not installed, it will launch cli-aptiX instead. So the translation shouldn’t mention Synaptic package manager, but only “Package manager”. Anyway, that is not an error so we can consider it normal behavior.

    Linuxdaddy, I would like to know more to be able to help you both in the development,

    Your tests and experience are the most important feedback to let us know how everything is going. That is more than enough.

    If there is a way to install with “vesa” and after installation always start with “vesa” I believe that it will no longer present the problems in the display of ISO menus “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” that occur in normal mode.

    For live booting, using “xorg=safe” is enough (I think). For installed systems, uninstalling xserver-xorg-video-fbdev for SIS systems and xserver-xorg-video-openchrome for VIA computers should be enough, but that is not possible right now, as I didn’t install them separately from main xserver-xorg package.

    I will improve that aspect and hopefully tomorrow get a new iso out, which you can test next week and weekend. Sleep well and make use only on big chunks of time. You say you spend a lot of time during the week moving on public transport, and getting home late and tired. Rest and leave the tests for the weekend.

    antiX Live system enthusiast.
    General Live Boot Parameters for antiX.

    #46024
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    marcelocripe
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    Xecure,

    I had forgotten to inform you that in the three tests with “vesa”, antiX worked in a stable way, as antiX 19.x behaves on compatible hardware. I ran several programs one after the other, including SpaceFm, Mirage, Terminal, Task Manager and so on, until Conky showed a consumption close to 512 MB of RAM and in no time the antiX you named “Lazarus” crashed or froze.

    It is in honor of which “Lazarus”:
    “The Resurrection of Lazarus is one of Jesus’ miracles, reported in John 11: 1-46, in which Jesus brings Lazarus of Bethany back to life after four days of burial.”
    or to
    “Lazarus is an integrated development environment developed for the Free Pascal compiler.”

    “It would be good to know if using fbdev with 24 bits color depth as linuxdaddy suggests can improve the experience on SIS achines without changing to a vesa driver (mainly the icons that disappear issue, that will probably influence other strange graphical behaviors).”

    Is the depth you mentioned related to 128 bits?

    As computers have little RAM, so I configured in the BIOS for the video card to share 64 MB of RAM, if I’m not mistaken, two computers allow to increase to 128 MB and the other computer that the maximum that can be shared are the 64 MB. If I am not mistaken in Windows there is an option to change the amount of colors from 32 bits to 24 bits for the video card. Would it be something equivalent to that depth?

    Xecure, I know it’s out of the subject of this topic, but I found it interesting to know the name of the original English menu “Manage Packages”, I searched https://www.transifex.com/anticapitalista/antix-development/viewstrings/#pt_BR , but unfortunately I did not find “Manage Packages” in the searches that I did, the searches only find the texts in English. During the tests of the ISO “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” I opened the program “Android Device USB Connect” and visualized that the texts needed the breaks to be properly tabulated. Today I managed to correct the line breaks in the texts from android-device-usb-connect.pot on the transifex website. As I visualize where the translations are displayed, I make the necessary corrections. The corrections and adaptations I am making to the texts of the translations in pt-BR are getting better every day. Matheus Motareli has already collaborated with some suggestions so that some texts could be easy for any user to understand.

    “I will improve that aspect and hopefully tomorrow get a new iso out, which you can test next week and weekend. Sleep well and make use only on big chunks of time. You say you spend a lot of time during the week moving on public transport, and getting home late and tired. Rest and leave the tests for the weekend. ”

    It is true, the lack of time and the responsibilities of life take away free time from us. If you agree, I will participate with a longer interval between posts. Even if I manage to do the tests at the end of the day at night, I will try to post the next day or the next day. Thank you for caring and understanding.

    Thanks.

    marcelocripe
    (Original text in Brazilian Portuguese)

    ———-

    Xecure,

    Eu havia me esquecido de te informar que nos três testes com o “vesa” o antiX funcionou de forma estável, como se comporta o antiX 19.x em um hardware compatível. Eu executei vários programas um seguido do outro, entre eles SpaceFm, Mirage, Terminal, Gerenciador de Tarefas e etc, até o Conky exibir um consume próximo de 512 MB de memória RAM e em nenhum momento o antiX que você nomeou de “Lazarus” travou ou congelou.

    É em homenagem a qual “Lazarus”:
    “A Ressurreição de Lázaro é um dos milagres de Jesus, relatado em João 11:1-46, no qual Jesus traz Lázaro de Betânia de volta à vida depois de quatro dias de sepultamento.”
    ou ao
    “Lazarus é um ambiente de desenvolvimento integrado desenvolvido para o compilador Free Pascal.”

    “It would be good to know if using fbdev with 24 bits color depth as linuxdaddy suggests can improve the experience on SIS achines without changing to a vesa driver (mainly the icons that disappear issue, that will probably influence other strange graphical behaviors).”

    A profundidade que você citou tem relação com os 128 bits?

    Como os computadores possuem pouca memória RAM, então eu configurei na BIOS para a placa de vídeo compartilhar 64 MB da memória RAM, se eu não me engano, dois computadores permitem aumentar para 128 MB e o outro computador que o máximo que pode ser compartilhado são os 64 MB. Se eu não me engano no Windows existe uma opção para alterar a quantidade de cores de 32 bits para 24 bits para a placa de vídeo. Por acaso seria algo equivalente a isso a profundidade?

    Xecure, eu sei que está fora do assunto deste tópico, mas achei interessante saber o nome do menu original em inglês “Manage Packages”, eu procurei https://www.transifex.com/anticapitalista/antix-development/viewstrings/#pt_BR, mas infelizmente eu não encontrei “Manage Packages” nas buscas que eu fiz, as buscas só encontram os textos em inglês. Durante os testes da ISO “antiX-19-legacy-bet1_386-base.iso” eu abri o programa “Android Device USB Connect” e visualizei que os textos precisavam das quebras para ficarem tabulados corretamente. Hoje eu consegui corrigir as quebras de linhas dos textos do android-device-usb-connect.pot no site transifex. Conforme que eu vou visualizando onde as traduções são exibidas, eu vou fazendo as correções necessárias. As correções e adaptações que eu estou fazendo nos textos das traduções em pt-BR estão cada dia melhores. O Matheus Motareli já colaborou com algumas sugestões para que alguns textos pudessem ficar fáceis para qualquer usuário poder compreender.

    “I will improve that aspect and hopefully tomorrow get a new iso out, which you can test next week and weekend. Sleep well and make use only on big chunks of time. You say you spend a lot of time during the week moving on public transport, and getting home late and tired. Rest and leave the tests for the weekend.”

    É verdade, a falta de tempo e as responsabilidades da vida vão tirando o tempo livre da gente. Se vocês concordarem, eu vou participando com um intervalo maior entre as postagens. Mesmo que eu consiga fazer os testes em um final do dia à noite, eu tentarei postar no dia seguinte ou no próximo dia. Agradeço por se importar e por compreender.

    Obrigado.

    marcelocripe
    (Texto original em Português do Brasil)

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