iso on cd

Forum Forums antiX-development Development iso on cd

  • This topic has 36 replies, 12 voices, and was last updated Oct 1-2:03 pm by anticapitalista.
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  • #37924
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    Brian Masinick
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    :D

    By the way I had to boot up Slackware Linux on floppy then bring the rest of the system in from CD. The image I had at the time only supported 640×480 resolution so I grabbed a newer graphical setup from my UNIX workstation, copied it to 3.25″ removable drive and copied it to get either 800×600 or VESA. Nothing better was available for my hardware at the time.

    Brian Masinick

    #37925
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    rokytnji
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    :D

    Well. What ever is decided. I try to keep in mind the ones with no internet service and a aged laptop who wants to boot something they can use offline. Even install off line if need be. But still have a editor, pdf reader, etc…… for offline usage. Living on the Texican border makes me think this way. Colonias and Barrios and all.

    What is weird. My 32 bit hardware has not all died yet. But software support is getting harder and harder to find.

    Kinda sorta a philosophy question.
    Do we support 3rd world hand me down gear. Or not.
    I know of some India motorcycle ,antix linux, users/shops who might be wondering of this.

    • This reply was modified 12 months ago by rokytnji.

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    #37927
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    seaken64
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    :D

    Well. What ever is decided. I try to keep in mind the ones with no internet service and a aged laptop who wants to boot something they can use offline. Even install off line if need be. But still have a editor, pdf reader, etc…… for offline usage. Living on the Texican border makes me think this way. Colonias and Barrios and all.

    What is weird. My 32 bit hardware has not all died yet. But software support is getting harder and harder to find.

    Kinda sorta a philosophy question.
    Do we support 3rd world hand me down gear. Or not.
    I know of some India motorcycle ,antix linux, users/shops who might be wondering of this.

    I think we do support hand me down gear. Not sure if the equipment from 3rd world is older than a Pentium-III with 512MB of RAM. I support several Pentium-III and P4 systems with antiX. Probably most hand me down gear is better than that these days. I think we can continue to support that gear even if on more than one CD. I’d rather see two CD’s instead of a single DVD.

    Seaken64

    #37998
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    christophe
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    :D

    Perhaps having a “base.gz” archive that will install directly from core. Perhaps, from using the core ISO, “antiX-base” could be listed as an option to install via the cli-installer, as a package.

    People like me who only run frugal/live wouldn’t be able to benefit from this, but we’d still have antiX full 32-bit, so that’s just as good (or better).

    (And do away with both base ISO 32 & 64-bit.)

    • This reply was modified 12 months ago by christophe.
    #38002
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    PDP-8
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    :D

    cristophe – that’s a great idea!

    But I think the real question is are we using antiX to maintain a vintage computer museum for kicks, or are we being limited by holding on to the past too long? (ie, confusing antiX with “antiques” instead of “antics”. 🙂

    I mean, I was sad when I couldn’t boot linux from a 50mb business card cd. (you can, but you gotta look -know how). I was sad when we lost support for booting from Iomega Zip-Drives. Earlier than that, 8 inch floppies, then 9-track mag tapes! 🙂

    So yeah, unless I’m doing the vintage computer thing, CD/DVD are just not part of my normal operations. In fact, any spinning rust HD’s or other mechanical drive is just vintage history to me for the most part, since computers are so cheap, and so low in power consumption, it just doesn’t make sense on a day to day operation. And I’m an OLD guy who remembers that stuff.

    #38004
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    KenzoG
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    :D

    PDP-8,
    Oh yes, computers are SO CHEAP – and don’t you mind adding to the dangerous garbage pile destroying the planet..
    In China – or many Latin American countries – you can buy a low end laptop for just one month’s minimum salary – provided that you don’t have to eat anything!
    In Laos – or most African countries – it will cost you at least three months minimum salary – again given that you don’t eat anything those months…

    • This reply was modified 12 months ago by KenzoG.
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    #38008
    Moderator
    Brian Masinick
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    :D

    PDP-8,
    Oh yes, computers are SO CHEAP – and don’t you mind adding to the dangerous garbage pile destroying the planet..
    In China – or many Latin American countries – you can buy a low end laptop for just one month’s minimum salary – provided that you don’t have to eat anything!
    In Laos – or most African countries – it will cost you at least three months minimum salary – again given that you don’t eat anything those months…

    Thank you for this enlightening information, KenzoG, and thank you for participating in this worthwhile discussion, adding details that many of us have been blissfully unware of.

    I’ve personally used antiX because

    1. It’s excellent and
    2. It runs very well on every desktop and laptop system that I have owned.

    Back when I was a UNIX development engineer I did know that many people did not have computer systems and that producing efficient products was one way to keep old hardware in service, but I don’t recall seeing actual statistics about this. Thanks again!

    Brian Masinick

    #38009
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    Brian Masinick
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    :D

    If we could also somehow add a volunteer program to contribute old computer systems to areas lacking them I would be happy to contribute anything I could spare.

    About two years ago I got rid of several working electronic devices including a few computer systems and I looked for places to donate. I ended up taking them to electronic disposal sites.

    Better information about how to donate such things (that can easily be found) would be a HUGE HELP. I’m saddened that I didn’t have the necessary information to donate my equipment to an appropriate place.

    I’d love to see a sticky, prominent section here with donation details so that people like me (who would be delighted and interested in donating but lack the information) will then be able to readily find it.

    Understand that I probably could have found something in time and with efforts, but I was retiring and moving with limited time to research. Knowing what you have shared leaves me with regret. I do recall that I donated some equipment to a place that I HOPE was able to reuse the equipment effectively, but I have no way of knowing what was done.

    Great conversation. Anyone able to start a new thread about hardware and software reuse and donation?

    Brian Masinick

    #38014
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    seaken64
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    :D

    The cost of recycling old computers is a road block for many people. Many of us would give our old computers away for free but we hesitate to pay to get rid of it. Traveling many miles or spending days researching possible places to take our old equipment encourages us to just take it to the transfer station. Unfortunately the transfer station does not put the computers back into use but sends them to a recycle center where everything is dismantled and separated into parts for further reclamation.

    I know there are computer re-use organizations around the country, or used to be. But I can’t locate an organization in my area. If there was an easy way to call such an organization and say “come pick it up” then it would probably happen. I don’t know how many organizations are transferring these computers to people in need. How does a computer get into the hands of the person who needs it? And can that person put antiX/Linux on the machine? or does that have to be done by an admin who then distributes the machine and offers to be the IT for that machine?

    It’s been awhile since I looked into this subject. I will see what I can learn and contribute to the subject on another thread.

    Seaken64

    #38017
    Moderator
    Brian Masinick
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    :D

    This is precisely the issues I faced when I was disposing of my systems.

    I’d be happy to donate them to someone but I am not in a financial position as a retiree to pay more money to give away anything.

    Believe me, I’m not greedy. I’m also not wealthy. I *might* have been able to do something, but our “retirement move” happened fast and, for better or worse took priority at the time.

    At one point in my life I would have even purchased a couple of NEW systems to give away (and I have given computer systems to people or provided free assistance).

    Knowing some of this, I’ll look into what might be possible to share equipment in the future.

    Brian Masinick

    #38038
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    mroot
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    Well hardware is getting cheaper. In 1996 a mid level desktop computer would cost you $2500 in inflation adjusted 2020 dollars. Now you can buy a mid level laptop for $500. A five fold reduction in price. You can buy used business class computers with 8 gigs of ram and 4th generation i5 processors on ebay in the 150-200 range. First and second gen systems go for less sometimes much less. So yes it’s easier to buy a computer now than it was in the 90s and even much much easier than it was in the 80s. Because it is cheaper people are more likely to buy newer hardware than repair old hardware or keep a computer when starts being “slow”. Now if the cost of computers went back up to 1980s levels people would repair them more and try to keep them longer. You would also have less e-waste in landfills since fewer people could afford them. I certainly couldn’t afford to buy a computer at 1980s prices.

    On the other hand the internet connection is not cheaper at least in the United States. I pay $600 a year for a slow broadband internet connection. For me there isn’t a cheaper option so the connection costs much more than the computer itself. If it lived in the city I could probably cut that cost in half. Another observer pointed out if you can afford the internet connection you can afford the hardware to run windows 10. I think there is certain amount of truth to this.

    In the US, I think if you income is low you get rid of your computer and use a smartphone instead….. you have to have a phone anyway. I see that with young people and retirees too. This is probably true world wide as well. I hope Marcelocripe comments here since he is in Brazil. I think he could tell us what the situation is in Brazil with old hardware. But I suspect that most people in Brazil have never heard of linux and use windows. A guy from Brazil I gamed with used a Mac he didn’t use linux. If they’re using windows then they’re taking a security risk or running windows 10 since older versions no longer get security updates. It’s the same in the US- people have little knowledge of linux. And ordinary people would never try to install an operating system. I found that true even with people that could easier learn how to do it.

    #38422
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    marcelocripe
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    :D

    Hello mroot, how are you?

    About your comment:

    In the US, I think if you income is low you get rid of your computer and use a smartphone instead… .. you have to have a phone anyway. I see that with young people and retirees too. This is probably true world wide as well. I hope Marcelocripe comments here since he is in Brazil. I think he could tell us what the situation is in Brazil with old hardware. But I suspect that most people in Brazil have never heard of linux and use windows. A guy from Brazil I gamed with used a Mac and he didn’t use linux. If they’re using windows then they’re taking a security risk or running windows 10 since older versions no longer get security updates. It’s the same in the US- people have little knowledge of linux. And ordinary people would never try to install an operating system. I found that true even with people that could easier learn how to do it.

    Unfortunately I only saw your post today (01-07-2020), I can share yes. I’ll try to summarize.

    In Brazil, more precise in the state of São Paulo and in the largest city in Brazil, which has the same name São Paulo, I mention a few cities that I was able to visit at work, all in the São Paulo metropolitan region, among them Atibaia, Mairiporã, Guarulhos, Diadema, Santo André and São Bernado, some names of indigenous origin, although there are not many descendants alive, therefore, we do not live in the middle of the forest, not least because they have already cut down a lot of green area and it no longer rains as it rained in the 1980s. richer have their beautiful houses close to the vast majority of the population who have simple or unfinished houses (own or rented out of wood or masonry), the social, cultural and economic differences are huge … however, it is not just ugly landscapes that there are in Brazil, there are beautiful places, that I never went to, but thanks to Google Maps, I was able to see beautiful places, here in Brazil or even in Monaco or Japan! With opportunities, many good things emerge from here, including three geniuses of motorsport Emerson Fittipaldi, Nelson Piquet and Ayrton Senna.

    I had my first contact with a Linux distribution through Telecentres between 2003 and 2004 (Telecentres are social projects that take or took access to computers in the suburbs, these neighborhoods are far from the central region and usually where the largest inequalities), unfortunately several units were closed. At that time I had the opportunity to learn to use a Linux distribution in a basic way (at the time I didn’t even know what Linux distribution was). In 2006 in the course of assembly, maintenance and configuration of computers by Intel Aluno Técnico (another social project offered to needy communities) I had the opportunity to participate, but the operating system covered was Windows, however much the users of the Telecentres looking for a foot in the start menu, they received parallel Windows installations (unfortunately!), similar to what you mentioned. If you ask the question, “why do people who need a Linux distro the most and don’t use it?”, Until yesterday I asked myself the same question, “why did I start studying a Linux distro so late?”, Yesterday, talking to a friend, with whom I learned a lot about informatics, we reached the following conclusion: to study Linux at the time between 2004 and 2006 we would need to have access to the internet, preferably at home and not just for 1 (one) hour in telecentres, distro courses Linux I never knew existed, the few that I learned were expensive, so we studied what we had access to or what was offered …

    https://telecentro.prefeitura.sp.gov.br/

    I have already mentioned something about this, in some Linux distro communities, the more experienced ones do not usually have the patience to teach the newbies, in some cases they do not encourage, force the newbies to give up … which is very bad for the growth of the community and the distribution itself. There are communities that I gave up, nobody helps and they only do self-propaganda.

    About smartphones, I agree in parts, yes it is true that many people stopped using computers and started using Android, because they are extremely basic users, what the smartphone offers is much more than they need to use, I know many people who have never operated a computer and went straight to smartphone, but there are many jobs and activities that are only possible through a computer, this is where social, cultural and economic differences appear. In 2005/2006 I was still installing Win 98, because people didn’t have the hardware that supported XP, if I knew I would have installed a Linux distro, but I still didn’t know how to install it, I barely knew how to use the operating system … U $ 1, 00 US dollar is quoted today at R $ 5.33 (reais), adding high taxes and import fees …, I believe that we will continue to repair old computers for many years, until there is no way to fix it, the Linux antix will help them to come back to use. With the Covid-19 pandemic, people are needing to use their computer more to be able to work at home.

    All computers (whether in paid work or in voluntary work), with some exceptions, have DVD / CD player, it is a pity that Blu Ray has not become popular here in Brazil, prices remain high, both for the reader device as the media. There are still computers that have only CR-RW.

    I would like to take this opportunity to suggest that it be made available in ISOs of up to 4.3GB of the entire antiX Linux repository, similar to what is done with Debian, where 3 ISOs are available, one with the installation and programs and the other two ISOs only with Software.

    In the previous texts a colleague describes that he has several pendrives, I own the MP3 Player that I use as if it were a 998MB pendrive (sorry that it is defective) and a 2GB pendrive, the data storage medium I use is the DVD. I don’t trust cloud storage, look at IG’s email, it was free and started to be paid, the same is happening with Bol’s email, cloud drives will at some point be able to do the same and will leave people without access to your data.

    On:
    “It’s the same in the US- people have little knowledge of linux”

    If people have little knowledge about Linux distro, it is the fault of the distros themselves that isolate themselves from each other, each in their respective world, each with their own package and so on. Not counting so many distro that were abandoned by its developers and they did not leave the project to continue with the community.

    marcelocripe

    Original text in Portuguese, translated into English by Google Translate

    ————–

    Olá mroot, tudo bem?

    Sobre o seu comentário:

    In the US, I think if you income is low you get rid of your computer and use a smartphone instead….. you have to have a phone anyway. I see that with young people and retirees too. This is probably true world wide as well. I hope Marcelocripe comments here since he is in Brazil. I think he could tell us what the situation is in Brazil with old hardware. But I suspect that most people in Brazil have never heard of linux and use windows. A guy from Brazil I gamed with used a Mac he didn’t use linux. If they’re using windows then they’re taking a security risk or running windows 10 since older versions no longer get security updates. It’s the same in the US- people have little knowledge of linux. And ordinary people would never try to install an operating system. I found that true even with people that could easier learn how to do it.

    Infelizmente eu só vi a sua postagem no dia de hoje (01-07-2020), posso compartilhar sim. Vou tentar resumir.

    No Brasil, mais preciso no estado de São Paulo e na maior cidade do Brasil, que possui o mesmo nome São Paulo, cito algumas cidades que pude conhecer a trabalho, todas da região metropolitana de São Paulo, entre elas Atibaia, Mairiporã, Guarulhos, Diadema, Santo André e São Bernado, alguns nomes de origem indígenas, apesar de não haver muitos descendentes vivos, por tanto, não moramos no meio do mato, até porque já derrubaram muita área verde e já não chove como chovia nos anos 80. Os mais ricos possuem as suas casa bonitas próximas a grande maioria da população que possuem casas simples ou inacabadas (próprias ou alugadas de madeira ou alvenaria), as diferenças sociais, culturais e econômicas são enormes …, contudo, não são só paisagens feias que existem no Brasil, existem lugares lindos, que eu mesmo nunca fui, mas graças ao Google Maps, pude ver lugares lindos, aqui no Brasil ou mesmo em Mônaco ou no Japão! Com oportunidades surgem muitas coisas boa daqui, inclusive três gênios do automobilismo Emerson Fittipaldi, Nelson Piquet e Ayrton Senna.

    Eu tive o meu primeiro contato com uma distribuição Linux por meio dos Telecentros entre 2003 e 2004 (Telecentros são projetos sociais que levam ou levavam o acesso a informática aos bairros das periferias, estes bairros são afastados da região central e normalmente onde encontram se as maiores desigualdades sociais), infelizmente várias unidades forma fechadas. Naquela época eu tive a oportunidade de aprender a usar de forma básica uma distribuição Linux (na época eu não sabia nem o que era distribuição linux). Em 2006 no curso de montagem, manutenção e configuração de computadores da Intel Aluno Técnico (outro projeto social oferecido para as comunidades carentes) eu tive a oportunidade de participar, mas o sistema operacional abordado era o Windows, por mais que as os usuários dos Telecentros olhassem para um pé no menu iniciar, recebiam instalações de Windows paralelos (infelizmente!), semelhantes ao que você citou. Se você fizer a pergunta: “por que pessoas que mais precisam de uma distro Linux e não as usam?”, até ontem eu me perguntava a mesma coisa, “por que eu comecei tão tarde a estudar uma distro Linux?”, ontem, conversando com um amigo, com quem aprendi muito sobre informática, chegamos a seguinte conclusão: para estudarmos Linux na época entre 2004 e 2006 precisaríamos ter acesso a internet, preferencialmente em casa e não somente por 1(uma) hora nos telecentros, cursos de distro Linux eu nunca soube que existia, os poucos que fiquei sabendo eram caros, então estudamos o que tivemos acesso ou o que foi ofertado …

    https://telecentro.prefeitura.sp.gov.br/

    Eu já citei algo sobre isso, em algumas comunidades de distro Linux, os mais experientes não costumam ter paciência em ensinar os novatos, em alguns casos não estimulam, forçam os novatos a desistir … o que é muito ruim para o crescimento da comunidade e da própria distribuição. Tem comunidades que desisti, ninguém ajuda e só fazem auto propaganda.

    Sobre os smartphones, concordo em partes, sim é verdade que muitas pessoas deixaram de usar computador e passaram a usar o Android, porque são usuários extremamente básicos, o que o smartphone oferece é muito mais do que precisam usar, conheço muitas pessoas que nunca operaram um computador e passaram direto para smartphone, mas tem muitos trabalhos e atividades que só são possíveis por meio de um computador, aí é onde as diferenças sociais, culturais e econômicas aparecem. Em 2005/2006 eu ainda instalava Win 98, porque as pessoas não tinha hardware que suportava o XP, se eu soubesse teria instalado uma distro Linux, mas eu ainda não sabia instalar, mal sabia usar o sistema operacional … U$ 1,00 dólar americano está cotado hoje a R$ 5,33 (reais), somando os altos impostos e taxas de importação …, acredito que continuaremos consertando computadores antigos por muitos anos, até não ter mais como consertar, o antix Linux vai ajudá-los a voltar a ter utilidade. Com a pandemia do Covid-19, as pessoas estão necessitando utilizar mais o computador para poderem trabalhar em casa.

    Todos os computadores (seja no trabalho remunerado ou no trabalho voluntário), salvo algumas exceções, possuem Leitor de DVD/CD, é uma pena que o Blu Ray não se tornou popular aqui no Brasil, os preços continuam altos, tanto para o dispositivo leitor quanto as mídias. Ainda tem computadores que possuem apenas CR-RW.

    Eu gostaria aproveitar para sugerir que fosse disponibilizado em ISOs de até 4.3GB de todo o repositório do antiX Linux, semelhante ao que é feito com o Debian, onde disponibilizam 3 ISOs, uma com a instalação e programas e as outras duas ISOs só com os programas.

    Nos textos anteriores um colega descreve que possui vários pendrive, eu possuo o MP3 Player que uso como se fosse um pendrive de 998MB (pena que ele está apresentando defeito) e um pendrive de 2GB, o meio de armazenamento dados que utilizo é o DVD. Eu não confio em armazenamento em nuvem, olha só o e-mail do IG, era gratuito e passou a ser pago, o mesmo está ocorrendo com o e-mail do Bol, os drives em nuvem em algum momento poderão fazer o mesmo e deixarão as pessoas sem acesso aos seus dados.

    Sobre:
    “It’s the same in the US- people have little knowledge of linux”

    Se as pessoas possuem pouco conhecimento sobre distro Linux, a culpa são das próprias distros que se isolam uma das outras, cada uma em seu respectivo mundo, cada uma com o seu próprio pacote e assim por diante. Sem contar com tantas distro que foram abandonadas pelos seus desenvolvedores e estes não deixaram com a comunidade a continuidade do projeto.

    marcelocripe

    Texto original no idioma português do Brasil, traduzido para inglês pelo tradutor do Google.

    • This reply was modified 11 months, 3 weeks ago by marcelocripe.
    • This reply was modified 11 months, 3 weeks ago by marcelocripe.
    #38424
    Moderator
    Brian Masinick
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    :D

    I’m curious, how much would it cost to mail (via postal mail) a few USB ‘sticks’ containing versions of Linux to somewhere in Brazil – (maybe to you)?

    If it were possible and not terribly expensive, perhaps a few of us could volunteer a few of our own USB devices – that is if it would be helpful on the equipment that you have. Some of us may also have CDs, DVDs, or other media that could be shared. What if five to ten people did this on a volunteer basis? How useful would it be – would it actually help someone or would more than one or two such things end up being wasted, lost, or thrown away? Would they be “taken” by someone or would they go to good use?

    Brian Masinick

    #38436
    Member
    mroot
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    :D

    Marcelocripe thank you for posting.

    #38438
    Moderator
    Brian Masinick
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    :D

    +1

    Brian Masinick

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