JWM theme scripts are outdated

[Member Wallon]

Dear All,

I wanted to check if anticapitalista updates the fr_BE translations with the new typographic apostrophes (with a rounded shape) by changing the font and font size in the JWM menu.

Nothing worked and I searched for a long time as there are not many scripts on the internet with the new JWM programming code.

I took the default theme and modified it.

I replaced the Ubuntu font (Regular) by the Times New Roman font (Regular).
I also managed to change the font size in the menus.

The Ubuntu font does not respect the standards established by the French language academies.
As a reminder, there are 2 academies in French (Canada and France).

I put here my script with the new lines for the fonts in the new programming language of JWM.

These lines need to be modified in all antiX 22/23 themes.

You will also find a screenshot of the default menu that I modified.
Sorry, the screenshot is blurry. I did this in 2 times with antixscreenshot2.
The first time, I made a screenshot of my 2 screens.
I took the first screenshot and had to rescreen part of the first screenshot.
You lose a lot of quality on the image.

On the internet, we also find this line of programming;
<Font>Dejavu-11:antialias=true:encoding=utf8</Font>
This part “:encoding=utf8” should not be put in the scripts because we obtain English apostrophes in fr_BE.
In a French script, you have to put “:encoding=fr_BE.utf8” or “:encoding=fr.utf8”
The easiest way is not to put this part because JWM uses the locale installed on the PC.
In my case, I get the rounded typographic apostrophe in my menus without putting “:encoding=…”.

I know people use IceWM a lot and nobody cares about JWM… but it’s the best window manager for multi-monitor computers.

Best regards,
Wallon

<!-- Title: Jwm-Vista Author: Tom new for jwm 2.0, replaces borderstyle above --> 
<!-- Modified by missTell for antiX 19 --> 

<JWM>

<WindowStyle> 
	<Font>Times New Roman-10:style=Regular:antialias=true</Font>
	<Width>6</Width 
	<Height>20</Height> 
	<Active> 
		<Foreground>gray20</Foreground> 
		<Background>gray70</Background> 
	<Outline>black</Outline> 
	</Active> 
	 
		<Foreground>gray70</Foreground> 
		<Background>gray20</Background> 
	<Outline>black</Outline> 
	 
</WindowStyle> 

<TaskListStyle> 
	<Font>Times New Roman-12:style=Regular:antialias=true</Font>
	<Active>
	<Foreground>gray90</Foreground> 
	<Background>gray30</Background> 
	</Active>
	
	<Foreground>gray90</Foreground> 
	<Background>gray50</Background> 
	
</TaskListStyle> 

<TrayStyle> 
	<Font>Times New Roman-12:style=Regular:antialias=true</Font>
	<Background>gray20</Background> 
	<Foreground>gray90</Foreground> 
</TrayStyle> 

<ClockStyle>
	<Font>Times New Roman-12:style=Regular:antialias=true</Font>
	<Foreground>gray90</Foreground>
	<Background>gray20</Background>
</ClockStyle>

<PagerStyle> 
	<Outline>black</Outline> 
	<Foreground>gray80</Foreground> 
	<Background>gray50</Background> 
	<Active>
	<Foreground>#2196F3</Foreground> 
	<Background>gray50</Background> 
	</Active>
</PagerStyle> 

<MenuStyle> 
	<Font>Times New Roman-15:style=Regular:antialias=true</Font>
	<Foreground>gray90</Foreground> 
	<Background>gray20</Background> 
        <Outline>black</Outline>
       <Active>
	<Foreground>white</Foreground> 
	<Background>#2196F3</Background> 
	</Active>
 <!--       <Opacity>0</Opacity> -->
</MenuStyle> 

<PopupStyle enabled="true">
	<Font>Times New Roman-10:style=Regular:antialias=true</Font>
	<Outline>black</Outline> 
	<Foreground>black</Foreground> 
	<Background>gray80</Background> 
</PopupStyle>

</JWM>

• This topic was modified 2 weeks, 2 days ago by Wallon.

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[Member Robin]

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Hello Wallon,

Wallon wrote:

Sorry, the screenshot is blurry. I did this in 2 times with antixscreenshot2.

Do you see any reason why the screenshot should be blurry? antiXscreenshot2 is designed to process the shots completely lossless, so it is pretty much next to impossible to get blurry screenshots from it: The screenshot antiXscreenhot2 takes is a 1:1 pixel-true copy from your screens (on contrast to classic antixscreenshot). So if your screen isn’t blurry, how should the screenshots be blurry then?

You state, you’ve captured both screens on a single shot. So it might be possible you have scaled the shot down using a fast scaling method not suitable? If resizing, make sure to use a high-quality algorithm instead of a fast one.

And then, please recheck, whether your shot looks still blurry if you set the display zoom scale in mtpaint postprocessing step to 100%

If you set the display zoom scale to 50% (to see the image containing both screens on one single screen) you’ll see a blurry image actually, but this is only since the screen you are editing the huge shot from two screens on can’t display it in sufficient resolution (It would need to have double resolution to avoid this). But this is a question of your display only, and the saved screenshot itself is perfectly fine and not blurry at all then.

My suggestion: Check your screenshots in 100% display resolution in mtpaint always, even when you have to scroll around then.

Btw, this is a known severe issue with mtpaint, not allowing any display zoom scale values between 50% and 100% (or between 100% and 200%), which is actually a problem when trying to edit an image of the very size of the screen itself in it. I have contacted the author of mtpaint already, but he won’t change this behaviour, so we’ll have to live with it. If I’d know another lightwight editor providing the functionality of mtpaint, I’d replace it. Unfortunately there is none. You’d need to use the bolide gimp to get similar processing options then.

As a dirty workaround you might use the antiXscreenshot2 -r (or –reduce) command line option, which exists exactly for this reason. This will resize your working copy to 85% of original size, which is the default behaviour of classic antiXscreenshot (what renders it unusable for high quality image processing). Even when the screenshot image might look on your screen with this switch less blurry when zoomed to 50%, you loose actually all the fine details in the resulting output image (as you do in classic antiXscreenshot always).

Wallon wrote:

You lose a lot of quality on the image.

Why? Please exactly describe what you did. As outlined, you lose a lot of quality with the classic antiXscereenshot, but this should never happen with antiXscreenshot2 (unless you reduce the image quality on purpose for reason).

Another explanation might be you have edited the image stored in a non-lossless format like jpg after you’ve left antiXscreenshot2. This will actually reduce the image quality with each new save. In order to be able to re-edit the images losslessly after leaving antiXscreenshot2, you need to store them in a lossless format like png. Then you can edit them as often you like. This is what antiXsscreenhsot2 itself also does when you edit the image multiple times within its internal workflow: The working copy is always lossless stored, and only on exit converted to other lossy formats.

So I recon you are not familiar with editing large high quality images on a display with limited display size and resolution. They do always look blurry when zoomed down on screen to see them completely. You need to check them in their native resolution, which means 100%, and not 50%.

Wallon wrote:

I replaced the Ubuntu font (Regular) by the Times New Roman font (Regular).
I also managed to change the font size in the menus.

You’ll probably see many antiX scripts fail, since they quite often rely on yad and/or gtkdialog. Both these helper tools fail on resizing their windows properly to the changed line length caused by the changed font and/or changed font size.
I’d suggest to select either carefully a default font not breaking the display of these scripts, or find somebody able and willing to fix the issues with window size in gtkdialog and yad.

Even if you change the system font for French, and somebody would do all the work to re-layout all the text strings within the scripts and all their translations to match your changed system, this would break the display for all languages and systems using fonts with any different tracking or size ( https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laufweite and https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeilendurchschuß ).

If you want to change it anyway, since the default font in use by antiX fails on some languages as you have stated, you need to use a replacement font with the very same relevant typographic characteristics https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Typography as the original font. It might need some try and error to find a free (in the sense of GPL) matching replacement.

Btw, your chosen replacement font „times new roman” is completely proprietary: See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monotype_Imaging and you can’t use it without license. While most PC users have the needed license, since Microsoft has licensed it from Monotype and sells it as part of the Windows OS’ literally every PC on the market comes with, but this does still not mean it is actually free.

Kind regards
Robin

Windows is like a submarine. Open a window and serious problems will start.

[Member Wallon]

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Dear Robin,

In antixscreenshot2, the option with a delay to capture screen 1 vertical, screen 2 horizontal or screen 3 horizontal is missing.
If we make a capture of 3 screens, we are obliged to take again the first capture on only one screen and we are obliged to zoom on the part to recapture. That’s a lot of operations.

Robin wrote:

You’ll probably see many antiX scripts fail, since they quite often rely on yad and/or gtkdialog. Both these helper tools fail on resizing their windows properly to the changed line length caused by the changed font and/or changed font size.
I’d suggest to select either carefully a default font not breaking the display of these scripts, or find somebody able and willing to fix the issues with window size in gtkdialog and yad.

This is really the big weakness of antiX. Even with the default font (Ubuntu), a German program like antiX-cli-cc does not work because the terminal window is not big enough.
https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/antix-cli-cc-display-bug/#post-105024

Regarding the Times New Roman font, I have paid for the licence and I have no problem with the rights.
This font is shorter than the Ubuntu font. You can put more text on one line.
Times New Roman displays the apostrophes well but the capital i looks like the lower case l.

But this is not the subject of my thread.
antiX needs to redo the JWM theme scripts.

Cordialement,
Wallon

[Forum Admin anticapitalista]

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The default theme for jwm and IceWM use Ubuntu font.
Most themes don’t, so choose another theme or edit one (as you did) that works best for you.

Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

[Member Wallon]

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Dear anticapitalista,

Will the theme scripts be modified with the new JWM programming language for antiX 23?

Kind regards,
Wallon

• This reply was modified 2 weeks, 1 day ago by Wallon.

[Forum Admin anticapitalista]

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Wallon wrote:

Dear anticapitalista,

Will the theme scripts be modified with the new JWM programming language for antiX 23?

Kind regards,
Wallon

Since your edits use a font that is not included on antiX, then no.

Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

[Member Xunzi_23]

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The times new OS family pack Licence is quoted on one site as 142,99 Euro for a one time purchase.

Single Styles of the font family 35,74 Euro.

Per user on a desktop machine.

Times New Roman
Times New Roman Bold
Times New Roman Bold Italic
Times New Roman Italic
Designers Monotype Type Drawing Office – Stanley Morison, Victor Lardent 1932
Copyright © 2017 The Monotype Corporation. All Rights Reserved.

Using the windoze fonts with Linux is infringment.

[Member Robin]

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Wallon wrote:

This is really the big weakness of antiX. Even with the default font (Ubuntu), a German program like antiX-cli-cc does not work because the terminal window is not big enough.
https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/antix-cli-cc-display-bug/#post-105024
…
But this is not the subject of my thread.

I did some research on the issue with the tracking (Laufweite) of other fonts in bash scripts using yad or gtkdialog, and will discuss the results in another thread.

————

Xunzi_23 wrote:

Using the windoze fonts with Linux is infringment.

Are you sure about this?

As said above, Microsoft has licensed these fonts from Monotype and made them available under their EULA, which allows redistribution and usage of the fonts as long you do it not for profit, some years ago. See:
https://web.archive.org/web/20091208063245/http://www.microsoft.com/typography/fontpack/eula.htm
http://corefonts.sourceforge.net/eula.htm

Quote:
»Reproduction and Distribution. You may reproduce and distribute an unlimited number of copies of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT; provided that each copy shall be a true and complete copy, including all copyright and trademark notices, and shall be accompanied by a copy of this EULA. Copies of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT may not be distributed for profit either on a standalone basis or included as part of your own product.«

Quote:
»Installation and Use. You may install and use an unlimited number of copies of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT.«

The msttcorefont package (sudo apt-get install ttf-mscorefonts-installer) installing the fonts on linux matches perfectly the EULA under which Microsoft has licensed these font packages. The installation and usage of the software is not restricted to Windows OS in this EULA, as you can read yourself, so I think you are perfectly fine to use it in Linux without any need of additional licensing for these fonts from Monotype directly. I can’t see any infringement.

But this still doesn’t make these fonts free software in the meaning of GPL.

Windows is like a submarine. Open a window and serious problems will start.

[Member Wallon]

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In Google Chrome, you can see the details of the fonts used for a site.
Look at the fonts used for the forum.
Microsoft is everywhere.

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[Member Xunzi_23]

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Hi Robin,
Messy theme, some MS fonts are legal if EULA is always included, many are not.
Times New Roman was updated in 2017 and is purchase only if not included in windoze..

Old version from original EXE files can be used, that is, I assume what is included in many still legal linux and BSD packages.
Versions from before 08.2002.

MS info from 2002
Reproduction and Distribution. You may reproduce and distribute an unlimited number of copies of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT; provided that each copy shall be a true and complete copy, including all copyright and trademark notices, and shall be accompanied by a copy of this EULA. Copies of the SOFTWARE PRODUCT may not be distributed for profit either on a standalone basis or included as part of your own product.

Newer version is outside of web fonts EULA as distribution was terminated many years ago. More infos over below links.
https://web.archive.org/web/20080327043239/http://blogging.biz/news/microsoft_yanks_core_fonts.html
https://learn.microsoft.com/de-de/typography/font-list/?FID=12
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Core_fonts_for_the_Web

[Member Wallon]

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For information, the Times New Roman font is on github (public access since 2013).

Times New Roman

[Member Robin]

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Hi Wallon,

Wallon wrote:

For information, the Times New Roman font is on github (public access since 2013).

Looks to me like pirated (stolen) fonts, in case it is really the monotype font and not something somebody has created on his own under the very font name. Most suspicious: No license information on this site at all. You should abstain from using it and use the font package available in debian repos (providing Times New Roman also) instead, which are properly licensed, since they observe strictly to supply you with all the original license and EULA texts and the full software package, just as the Microsoft EULA enforces, under which the fonts are legally distributable. This is the single way you can use these fonts legally without paying licensing fees to monotype.

sudo apt-get install ttf-mscorefonts-installer

Windows is like a submarine. Open a window and serious problems will start.

[Moderator Brian Masinick]

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Robin wrote:

Hi Wallon,

Wallon wrote:

For information, the Times New Roman font is on github (public access since 2013).

Looks to me like pirated (stolen) fonts, in case it is really the monotype font and not something somebody has created on his own under the very font name. Most suspicious: No license information on this site at all. You should abstain from using it and use the font package available in debian repos (providing Times New Roman also) instead, which are properly licensed, since they observe strictly to supply you with all the original license and EULA texts and the full software package, just as the Microsoft EULA enforces, under which the fonts are legally distributable. This is the single way you can use these fonts legally without paying licensing fees to monotype.

sudo apt-get install ttf-mscorefonts-installer

I agree; moreover those ttf-mscorefonts-installer fonts are pretty decent, and they’re now free; if there ever were any costs, they’ve been paid for.

--
Brian Masinick

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