- This topic has 28 replies, 9 voices, and was last updated Mar 27-8:54 pm by Brian Masinick.
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BobC
I should be clear, my wife isn’t a technical wiz, and has a former gaming desktop from about 2010 or so that runs Win/10 and was setup by, and has been maintained by my son.
Well my son has moved out, and it seems that every time she goes looking for Swedish meatballs recipes she ends up on a screen telling her the computer has been infected by a few viruses and to call Microsoft at such and such a number, etc. It all looks very real and official, and she ends up panicked. This is the 2nd time in a month. Last time my son came over for supper and fixed it, but didn’t elaborate to me what the problem was, or how he fixed it this time.
She told me it only happens when she tries to get recipes for Swedish Meatballs!
Anyway, I updated the virus scanner and it spent 4 hours scanning, and nothing was found. It turns out that some site takes over the browser when she goes hunting for recipes.
The 4 hours to scan was becoming a problem, so I took a 2014 I5 based Dell laptop and fired up the USB that I had been using to test FT10 recently for PPC’s project. I added gnome-games, with aisleriot, and the HP printing utilities, added the things she likes to do to the toolbar and remastered it. With a few minutes of showing how to boot it and set it up to run the programs she wanted at the end of the boot via startup, and she lasted the day doing her browsing and emails and game playing without any problems or questions.
After work, by the end of the day the scan had finished, so while she was fixing supper, I shut down the antiX 21 FT10 laptop, and Win/10 desktop, and rebooted the desktop with the flashdrive I had created for the laptop, adjusted startups, default browser tabs and toolbar again, and remastered it. I helped her test it by having her do the same search for Swedish Meatball recipes, but she couldn’t recall which was the one that caused the virus attack, so we tried them all.
She has been using it all week that way, and it hasn’t told her to call Microsoft for a whole week. With the FT10 she has barely noticed that she isn’t using MS Win and no longer has any performance complaints, either. She did ask about the trash. She was very worried about that. I told her I’d show her. PPC’s most recent FT10 has it built in đ
So I just wanted to say Thanks to Everyone that has contributed to make antiX as fast and resilient as it is, and to PPC and his FT10 that passed my wife’s test!
For normal people, these attacks, and trying to recover, with scans, and support issues are very scary. It was great to be able to rescue the situation.
PPC
it only happens when she tries to get recipes for Swedish Meatballs!
That cracked me up… Boy those scammers do have some strange options đ
Thanks for the kind words about FT10 – it’s aim is exactly that: to make antiX perfectly usable for the common user that knows nothing about Operating Systems and just wants to use the computer for perfectly ordinary tasks like playing causal games, office work or searching for meatball recipes… with almost 0 learning curve
P.
- This reply was modified 1 year, 1 month ago by PPC.
Yes, I think we are over the “ease of use” hurdle, but being realistic, I don’t think she would have found antiX or FT10, or been able to install them all on her own.
But at least she is able to use it without ending up totally frustrated by any of the minor differences in user interface standards like single click launch from the file manager, or lack of trash recovery that have turned all previous attempts getting her to try Linux into failures. That is a significant improvement over my previous attempt at getting her to use Linux about 7 years ago, which ended in my son giving her his old Win/10 machine when I gave him enough money to get a new machine for Christmas.
It’s really pretty amazing to see her using a system that defines “Lean and Mean”, intended to preserve the usefulness of old/slow hardware with one package of tweaks set to its defaults, and not having problems.
Now the most difficult part is when it boots, instead of booting on a delay, she has to press up arrow and press enter to boot antiX 21. For now I want to just run it from flashdrive, and have asked her to save things in her email folders on the web. I need to think that through. I do like the appliance concept (ie use the computer like a toaster) though.
anticapitalista
Nice story, thanks for sharing.
Due to work, I have been using Windows10 every day for the past week or so and I find it totally incomprehensible.
I really detest the way it is set out and quite honestly it is far from being easy to use in my opinion.I guess it is all down to familiarity not some ‘ideal/modern’ way for the desktop to look and function.
Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.
antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.
Me too, anti. All day, every day.
For me, like my wife, I’ve used MS systems since PCDOS 1.0 and so much of it is familiar to the point of being automatic. It’s difficult to get yourself to adjust to something different after decades of familiarity, and switching back and forth constantly. That’s why setup defaults and tuning flexibility are so important.
The newer MS stuff drives me insane though. Its like they expect ME to do work for the computer instead of the other way around!
Three cheers for you for your creating this OS!!!
marcelocripe
I liked the story, it is very similar to what I hear every time I deliver a new antiX installation.
The working materials are:
-USB devices and DVDs;
-Full official antiX ISOs (19.5 and 21)
-The unofficial antiX ISOs (32 and 64 bit antiX 21 Full Remaster with Kernel 4.4.0-296 and the pseudo-antix-19 legacy bet3 with Kernel 4.4.0-264 from Xecure);
-The my-offline-repo-0118.zip package installation program from Xecure;
–Various programs developed by the antiX community;After all the work of configuring antiX after installation on hard disk, it was not difficult for me to hear one of the following phrases “What ‘Windows’ is this?” or “antiX is easier to operate than Windows.”
Since the latest versions of PPC’s FT10 package are available and with the feature to disable FT10 with one click, I always install FT10 and always hear at the end one of the phrases “What ‘Windows’ is this?” or “antiX is easier to operate than Windows.”. That is, after the increasing pt-BR translations of antiX and now with FT10, the times I hear the phrase “antiX is easier to use than Windows” has increased a lot.
As I have written before, here on the forum, PPC’s FT10 will be in every new installation I do of antiX. PPC’s FT10, looks like a full desktop environment. Definitely, PPC’s FT10 is on my list of work stuff. Who knows, maybe anticapitalista will want to include FT10 in ISO full in the future.
I also want to thank all the people who share their knowledge, their programs, BobC who got interested and contributed somehow to FT10, PPC for creating FT10 and anticapitalista for creating antiX.
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Eu gostei da história, ela é muito semelhante ao que esculto sempre que entrego uma nova instalação do antiX.
O material de trabalho sĂŁo:
-Dispositivos USB e DVDs;
-As ISOs full oficiais do antiX (19.5 e 21);
-As ISOs não oficiais do antiX (Remasterização do antiX 21 Full de 32 e 64 bits com o Kernel 4.4.0-296 e a pseudo-antix-19 legacy bet3 com Kernel 4.4.0-264 do Xecure);
-O programa de instalação de pacotes sem acesso à internet my-offline-repo-0118.zip do Xecure;
–VĂĄrios programas desenvolvidos pela comunidade antiX;Depois de todo o trabalho de configuraçÔes do antiX apĂłs instalação no disco rĂgido, nĂŁo era difĂcil eu ouvir uma das seguintes frases âQue âWindowsâ Ă© esse?â ou âO antiX Ă© mais fĂĄcil de operar do que o Windows.â
Desde que as versĂ”es mais recentes do pacote FT10 do PPC estĂŁo disponĂveis e com o recurso de desativar o FT10 com um clique, eu sempre instalo o FT10 e sempre ouço no final uma das frases âQue âWindowsâ Ă© esse?â ou âO antiX Ă© mais fĂĄcil de operar do que o Windows.â. Ou seja, depois da crescente traduçÔes pt-BR do antiX e agora com o FT10, aumentou bastante as vezes que eu ouço a frase âO antiX Ă© mais fĂĄcil de utilizar do que o Windows.â
Como eu escrevi antes, aqui no fórum, o FT10 do PPC estarå em todas as novas instalaçÔes que eu fizer do antiX. O FT10 do PPC, se parece com um ambiente de trabalho completo. Definitivamente, o FT10 do PPC estå na minha lista de material de trabalho. Quem sabe, o anticapitalista queira incluir o FT10 na ISO full no futuro.
Eu também quero aproveitar para agradecer todas as pessoas que compartilham os seus conhecimentos, os seus programas, ao BobC que se interessou e contribuiu de alguma forma pelo FT10, ao PPC por criar o FT10 e ao anticapitalista por criar o antiX.
ModdIt
Absolutely agree with what BobC wrote.
The newer MS stuff drives me insane though. Its like they expect ME to do work for the computer instead of the other way around!
And you are expected buy a new computer every couple of years, lot of pretty good hardware being offered second hand due win 11.
@BobC which Browser was getting the drive by attacks and wonderful popups. Maybe we can get some more microsoft senior genius fake support persons fuming.
Loved the senior genius tag used by a lady scam caller recently. They borrowed it from Rotten Fruit shops.
Brian Masinick
Count me ‘fortunate’ in some cases.
1) I got a hold of DOS and Windows in the ‘early days’ when it was fun to use.
2) I was using mainframe systems early in my career, so getting my hands on real time systems, UNIX systems, a MULTICS system and DOS systems was fun and interesting, though I always found both DOS and Windows to be so much less capable than any UNIX system.
3) When I got my first chance to use Linux, I found it familiar because not only were the commands very similar, I was already using many of the same GNU utilities on my UNIX workstation and server as I used on my first Slackware Linux distribution.
- This reply was modified 1 year, 1 month ago by Brian Masinick.
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Brian MasinickI have seen so many machines dumped because the machine got virused, and it wasn’t worth reloading because it didn’t have enough memory or disk, or couldn’t run the newest OS, or would just be too slow.
Planned obsolescence, with the viruses helping them to die sooner…
PS: We got the HP printer/scanner working, and I added a Live-usb-storage shortcut to the bookmarks on zzzFM, and showed her how to create folders. I didn’t test the Trash, yet, though.
So at this point, she’s running from a flashdrive, pretty safe from the malware and viruses, and able to save individual things like pics and docs permanently to the flashdrive. I suppose that’s not perfect, because something could come along and corrupt those files, and I added a Remaster icon, but there are so many steps to it that I’ve been running it myself instead of showing her how. Any better suggestions on running a “kiosk” system that is not susceptible to viruses and malware, but can still be easily used to do normal personal things, and create/save/maintain some photos, links and documents… Hmmmmm, maybe things like the browser bookmarks should be in Live-usb-storage so she doesn’t need to remaster just to save a bookmark.
PSS: Hmmmm, I don’t think its checking for updates, but not sure how that should be handled given that its a “kiosk” system. Also, the time was set for Brazil, LOL. I got it changed, but it would make more sense for it to use internet time by default if connected, and otherwise whatever timezone was selected at boot (which was selected).
Oh, and anti, my wife says her machine is much faster, now. I bet that makes you feel good đ When she told me that, I went and looked, and its a 30,000 bogomips machine that MS had turned into a SLOTH.
- This reply was modified 1 year, 1 month ago by BobC.
- This reply was modified 1 year, 1 month ago by BobC.
christophe
@BobC – Consider a small home persistence file (persist_home). You make all folders as shortcuts to Live-usb-storage, including ~/Downloads, ~/Documents, etc. (like it sounds like you are doing). So then virtually nothing is being saved in the actual home persistence file.
The home persistence will then only be used for all those “dot” files, including the browser’s files, so all her bookmarks will be saved. If you go with 500 MB, that would be MORE THAN enough. (On one of mine, I wanted to test how low I could go, and I tested 150MB home persistence. It even works well at that size!) So no need to remaster if I make a bookmark or change the wallpaper, etc.confirmed antiX frugaler, since 2019
Yes, maybe I should do it that way… Then remastering would not need to be done unless software changes were made.
anticapitalista
Yes, maybe I should do it that way⊠Then remastering would not need to be done unless software changes were made.
This is an example of a use case of only using homefs persistence.
Once all is set up to user’s satisfaction, there is no need to use root persistence, only home persistence.Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.
antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.
I didnât test the Trash, yet, though.
The zzzfm’s Trash can should work normally even in Live mode – just keep an eye in the disk space, because it can fill up in an instant, if your wife deletes large files…
I donât think its checking for updates
Even if the “auto-updates” option is checked in the “Enable FT10” window, FT10 does not check for updates – it merely reminds users to update at least once a week. also the script just displays the “You should check for updates” warning once a day, not to bother users too much… The script does not perform any action other than checking how long ago was the last “apt update” performed.
For real automatic updates (which require an application always running on the background) I advice apt-notify, installable from the Package Installer…her machine is much faster, now
Tell your wife it’s the antiX “magic” đ
I also would go with homefs persistence for that particular live system use case (with the option to save changes on the fly, if I recall correctly)
EDIT:
Also – on the browser bookmarks situation- if you don’t mind the possible loss of privacy, if your wife uses firefox, she could log on to her firefox account, and syncronise everything to the cloud…P.
- This reply was modified 1 year, 1 month ago by PPC.
Brian Masinick
As we continue with this discussion, I am reminded of the days between 2011 and 2014, when I lived near my mother (and for a short while, actually lived with her).
My nephew had given her a Dell D600 series laptop; I once owned a D610 myself; they were nice systems back in time…
Anyway, my mother was not an astute computer user. When I was in HIGH SCHOOL (wow, that was a LONG time ago, all of my family is now retired!) she used to use a computer because she worked in the counseling office at the local middle school (we called it “Junior High School” back then).
So when we FAST forward to the 2000s, my mother was retired and I was 2/3 to 3/4 of the way through my career…
The Dell was solid, but it was AGING. It had Windows XP on it (I think). The unit worked, but to my way of thinking, it ran like an aging dog.
So I asked my mom a few questions about what she actually used, and how, if ever, she used the system.Armed with this information, I installed a version of whatever antiX was available back then, probably the 2011 edition, backed by “Testing” rather than “Stable”, so that it could be easily updated (typically by me; she had NO IDEA how to do such things).
I think I had it boot straight to the desktop. I either put program icons on the task bar or desktop icons, that, when invoked, would bring up the few things she actually used. It worked, and she used it, not a lot, but she did use it.
Some time along the way, I think I booted the thing and it had a Windows update, so you may guess, Windows took over the boot loader. The next time the system booted, it came up in Windows first.
It was very interesting! For all the supposed thinking that Windows is easier for the casual user, this wasn’t the case for my mother!
Why? Very simple: I was able to custom configure the antiX setup so that the only icons and the only obvious choices available were the ones that she ACTUALLY used and accessed, and I configured it that way after asking and learning what she used.
About a year later, my neighbor across the street had a similar issue; his aging laptop wasn’t performing very well. He had the choice of buying another computer or getting something simple. I did the same thing again, interviewed the neighbor and set up his system with ONLY antiX, removing what was previously there and keeping only the apps and Web sites he ACTUALLY used, and he got another year or two out of his system too.
The moral of my story, and it meshes well with what PPC does, is that we select, configure, and modify the system so that it easily performs, or has easy access to, the things that people actually use. There is NO DOUBT that antiX can be set up for easy user configuration and use. I’ve long recommended that we do so, because experienced users can go out and get fancy window managers or desktop managers and the fancy app of the day. Beginning users, or users with aging equipment don’t have a lot of choices about what works, and is still reasonably easy to use. Therefore the best thing we can do is find the most reasonable compromises that deliver reasonable features, a light to moderate footprint, easy for people to customize (especially for those of us who can do so), a straightforward way to add or tailor what we offer to our specific user communities. It’s difficult to make it perfect for everyone, so it makes sense to make it straightforward for those who have equipment that has some life left in it, but isn’t jam packed with gobs of excess capacity.
The FT10 is one very good example of a tool that isn’t (or wasn’t) standard equipment, but exists now as a community tool, and can be set up and possibly fine tuned to the needs of the community. I urge those of us who do have skills to help those who don’t (even if only occasionally), so that more people will keep aging computers working instead of lining toxic waste dumps with electronic waste that damages the ecosystem of the world around us.
There are DIFFERENT ways to do this; FT10 is one VERY good way; there are others. As I said, I hand customized two different computers for two people with solid, but aging systems. I’ve had aging computers myself; I have some current generation plus 2-3 older generation systems now. I use the leading edge siduction and EndeavourOS as two examples of what I use on the newer stuff most often; I also use the AHS MX Linux. On the older system I use antiX, Debian, the classic MX Linux and a lighter implementation of PCLinuxOS; that way I get a “work out” with both the old and the new.
I hope this gives a few of you some ideas, and maybe some encouragement to help people get some life out of their trash heap of computers by fine tuning antiX to do specific things on those old, but not deceased, still silver and gold working computers!
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Brian MasinickThere are many similarities in these stories. The names and dates and model numbers differ, but it says there is quite a need out there amongst the general populace for systems that just work, for the user, not MS.
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