- This topic has 31 replies, 13 voices, and was last updated Feb 21-8:34 pm by ModdIt.
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Anonymous
Hey!
ventoy and balenaEtcher and mintStick and Plop and ohMyMultiboot and CapserAintYerFriend…
lead to a less-than-ideal outcome.
Recommending them (other than for exceptional cases, e.g. Plop!) is a DISSERVICE.https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/drag-and-drop-iso-to-usb-can-boot-multiple-isos/#post-44057
The Ventoy part works as advertised, allowing dynamically choosing any ISO from USB drive, including an antiX iso. BUT, an antiX booted this way does NOT have all the writable features available from a standard antiX liveUSB. So, Ventoy does not bring real value to my daily antiX workflow, and remains just a toy (pun not intended) to host a couple other distro for me.
reposting here my previous antixforum post, quoting BitJam, the primary developer of the antiX Live system
https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/drag-and-drop-iso-to-usb-can-boot-multiple-isos/#post-44048
^— one of my several previous posts on this subject so, yeah, it’s exasperating to find again today that this info needs to be repeated, reposted.https://forum.mxlinux.org/viewtopic.php?f=108&t=59905
by BitJam » Tue Aug 18, 2020
the Ventoy Github site says:
“Ventoy is an open source tool to create bootable USB drive for ISO files. With ventoy, you don’t need to format the disk over and over, you just need to copy the iso file to the USB drive and boot it.”
This is the old “boot from iso mode” which we support but do not recommend. We offer a “fromiso=<file>” boot option for this but I imagine Ventoy is using grub to mount the iso file automatically. Once you get it to boot (we have Grub experts here who may be able to help you with the grub entry if it’s not working) then you can add one of the following boot options to specify a read-write persistence partition where we can store our persistence files:pdev=xxxx (the persistence partition name such as sdb1 or /dev/sdb1)
puuid=xxxx (the UUID of the persistence partition)
plab=xxxx (the label of the persistence partition)The first time persistence is enabled we will create the persistence files for you if they don’t already exist. So all you need to do is point us to a read/write partition with one of the options above and you can also specify the form of persistence you want to use (with another option) if you don’t like the default. Normally we offer to save any boot parameters you used but booting directly from iso makes this either very difficult or impossible.
We support booting from iso file but we don’t recommend it because it’s not compatible with many of our extensive live-usb features. For example the live-remaster tool does not work with direct booting from an iso file. You could probably do this on your own by first making an iso snapshot and then manually copying the iso snapshot file overwriting the original iso file.
IF you want to try our extensive live-usb features then we recommend you use the live-usb-maker tool which comes with MX and antiX Linux. There is also an AppImage available if you want to run it on another Linux distro. Many people only run MX/antiX live using persistence and remastering to keep their changes. We tried to make this a “distro development tool” for creating your own customized version of antiX or MX. The constraints of booting directly from an iso file conflict with this distro development approach and also conflict with many of our other advanced features. It’s sort of like trying to combine a school bus with a Ferrari.
If onboarding from windows O/S,
“rufus” http://rufus.ie/ is a suitable utility
(skip the “setup persistence” option within rufus, during antiX liveboot you will, optionally, setup persistence)If onboarding from another linux distribution, live-usb-maker is THE ideal utility to use.
https://mxlinux.org/blog/live-usb-maker-tool-now-available-as-an-appimage
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anticapitalista
antiX devs have never recommended use of ventoy and balenaEtcher. We have always told users to use LUM.
Not sure why you posted this skidoo.Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.
antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.
“why” in reaction to noticing today’s ongoing discussion here
https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/instalacao-antix/anticapitalista
“why” from finding them mentioned in today’s ongoing discussion here
https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/instalacao-antix/I don’t speak Portuguese, but no dev was involved in that discussion suggesting use of ventoy or balenaEtcher.
Are you suggesting we have a ‘sticky’ to make it clear that antiX does not support such apps?
Might be worthwhile if you think so.Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.
antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.
olsztyn
antiX devs have never recommended use of ventoy and balenaEtcher. We have always told users to use LUM.
I admit I am a bit confused by this discussion. Once you have antiX in place, whether installed or Live on USB stick, there is no question in my my mind that LUM and ISO-Snapshot are superior tools to proceed from such antiX instance. And I would not think where BalenaEtcher or similar would play any role once you have antiX in place as Live, as you can install from Live or create another instance using LUM.
However initially, when you just downloaded antiX ISO and do not have antiX already installed you do need a tool to create a bootable USB stick from such antiX ISO, as not having antiX installed yet you do not have yet LUM or ISO-Snapshot. This initial state is where BalenaEtcher or Rufus comes in handy to create such bootable USB from the downloaded antiX ISO, unless you want to burn such ISO to disk and boot from DVD drive…
Please let me know if I misunderstood the meaning of this conversation…
Thanks and Regards…Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_Parameters
rokytnji
Hmmm. Wondering about the plop mention myself
Learned a while back to use dd on iso hybrids like antix.
So only concerned about my old Plop floppy disc. < Old old version of Plop >Sometimes I drive a crooked road to get my mind straight.
Not all who Wander are Lost.
I'm not outa place. I'm from outer space.Linux Registered User # 475019
How to Search for AntiX solutions to your problemszeh
However initially, when you just downloaded antiX ISO and do not have antiX already installed you do need a tool to create a bootable USB stick from such antiX ISO, as not having antiX installed yet you do not have yet LUM or ISO-Snapshot. This initial state is where BalenaEtcher or Rufus comes in handy to create such bootable USB from the downloaded antiX ISO, unless you want to burn such ISO to disk and boot from DVD drive…
The recommended for MX is Rufus, so it goes for antiX as well, I guess.
https://mxlinux.org/download-links/
From section 4.:
“If you want to create a USB on a Windows base, we suggest you use Rufus, which supports our bootloader.”https://mxlinux.org/wiki/system/iso-download-mirrors/
From the Checksums and signatures of Final ISOs section:
“In MS Windows®, the easiest way to ensure integrity (as well as to create the live USB) is to use the USB formatting utility Rufus, which automatically runs a check.”- This reply was modified 2 years, 2 months ago by zeh.
marcelocripe
@skidoo,
I thank you for caring and for creating this new topic.
Through the WhatsApp and Telegram groups, Matheus told me that he returned to the topic https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/instalacao-antix/, including his name as the last one to post, but even the your post doesn’t appear at the moment, I imagine it ended up in the spam box.
Even if you (skidoo) don’t speak Portuguese, you cared for us, you certainly took the trouble to translate it into your language. This is a valuable action, given that Matheus is a newcomer in the “Linux world” and more precisely here in the antiX community. Thank you very much!
Normally, people will have Windows available to prepare the pendrive to come to know the “Linux world” and get to antiX or any other Linux distribution. This is the path I took, from Windows to antiX and I believe that many other people have followed this same path.
On the programs to prepare a bootable USB drive to install antiX, I tested several programs, including Rufus. Among them, Sardu, Unetbootin Windows, Win Setup From USB, Balena Etcher Portable, Image USB, ROSA Image Writer, Universal USB Installer, YUMI and most of them complain about the type of antiX ISO compression. Some programs do not complain about anything, they do the process of preparing the pendrive and then the computer is unable to boot from the pendrive. Some of these programs even reach the antiX options menu of the screen image that @Xecure kindly posted to guide me on the topic https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/how-to-set-the-set-gfxmode-1024x768x16-1024×768/page/2/#post-37742, but does not boot antiX graphically. Is the problem with the antiX ISO or is the problem with these programs?
The Etcher balena was the program that had no problems booting on different motherboards. On the motherboard that ventoy can’t load the ISO boot from antiX, the balena Etcher can. I don’t like the Etcher balena, because depending on the version of Windows the partition of the pendrive is not visible, besides the work having to format the pendrive every time it is necessary to use another ISO of antiX. That’s why I prefer multiple ISOs on DVD media.
Now I’m the one with the most doubts …
@Anticapitalista cited the “LUM” program. I don’t know this program. I searched the internet and did not find this program. Does this program work on Windows? What is the full name of this “LUM” program and what is the website for us to download it from?
Which program or programs to prepare the bootable USB stick to install antiX and still allow the use of persistence?
In addition to ventoy, there are other programs that facilitate the replacement of ISO, how is it possible to do it with ventoy?
Complete and correct information is difficult to obtain and is all we need. When we don’t have complete and correct information, we use what we have available, we don’t always know enough, but we still try to help ourselves and that’s what really matters …
I thank you for caring, regardless of the language.
marcelocripe
(Original text in Brazilian Portuguese)———-
@skidoo,
Eu agradeço por você se importar e por criar este novo tópico.
Através dos grupos de WhatsApp e Telegram, o Matheus me disse que retornou ao tópico https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/instalacao-antix/, inclusive aparece o nome dele como sendo o último a postar, mas até o momento não aparece a sua postagem, eu imagino que tenha ido parar na caixa de spam.
Mesmo você (skidoo) não falando o idioma Português, você se importou conosco, certamente se deu o trabalho de traduzir para o seu idioma. Isso é uma ação valorosa, haja vista que o Matheus é um recém chegado no “mundo Linux” e mais precisamente aqui na comunidade antiX. Muito obrigado!
Normalmente as pessoas terão um Windows disponível para preparar o pendrive para virem conhecer o “mundo Linux” e chegar até o antiX ou a qualquer outra distribuição Linux. Este é o caminho que eu fiz, do Windows para o antiX e acredito que muitas outras pessoas também fizeram este mesmo caminho.
Sobre os programas para preparar pendrive inicializável para fazer a instalação do antiX, eu testei diversos programas, inclusive o Rufus. Entre eles, Sardu, Unetbootin Windows, Win Setup From USB, balena Etcher Portable, Image USB, ROSA Image Writer, Universal USB Installer, YUMI e a maioria deles reclamam do tipo de compactação da ISO do antiX. Alguns programas não reclamam nada, fazem o processo de preparação do pendrive e depois o computador não consegue inicializar a partir do pendrive. Alguns destes programas inclusive consegue chegar até o menu de opções do antiX da imagem da tela que o @Xecure gentilmente postou para me orientar no tópico https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/how-to-set-the-set-gfxmode-1024x768x16-1024×768/page/2/#post-37742, mas não inicializa em modo gráfico o antiX. O problema está na ISO do antiX ou o problema está nestes programas?
O balena Etcher foi o programa que não apresentou problemas para inicializar em diferentes placa-mãe. Na placa-mãe que o ventoy não consegue carregar a inicialização da ISO do antiX, o balena Etcher consegue. Eu não gosto do balena Etcher, pois dependendo da versão do Windows a partição do pendrive não fica visível, além do trabalho ter que formatar o pendrive toda vez que é preciso utilizar outra ISO do antiX. É por isso que prefiro várias ISOs em uma mídia de DVD.
Agora sou eu que fico com mais dúvidas ainda…
O @anticapitalista citou o programa “LUM”. Eu não conheço este programa. Eu pesquisei na internet e não encontrei este programa. Por acaso este programa funciona no Windows? Qual é o nome completo deste programa “LUM” e em qual é o site para podermos baixá-lo?
Qual ou quais programas para preparar o pendrive inicializável no Windows para fazer a instalação do antiX e ainda permitir o uso da persistência?
Além do ventoy, existem outros programas que facilitam a substituição da ISO, como é possível fazer com o ventoy?
Informação completa e correta é difícil de obter e é tudo que precisamos. Quando não possuímos a informação completa e correta, utilizamos o que temos disponível, nem sempre sabemos o suficiente, mas mesmo assim tentamos nos ajudar e é isso que realmente importa…
Eu agradeço por se importarem, independentemente do idioma.
marcelocripe
(Texto original em Português do Brasil)
christophe
@marcelocripe: “LUM” is just a quick way to write “Live USB Maker”
@rokytnji:
Hmmm. Wondering about the plop mention myself
I read it as skidoo is saying that plop is the exception to the “rule” in this discussion.
confirmed antiX frugaler, since 2019
Hi. I posted a followup here (prior to olsztyn’s post) but it is being held up by the spamfilter. In that post you’ll notice that I’m suggesting how (not via a sticky) the “onboarding” instructions could be improved.
Placed this topic in Kafeino instead of nosing into the ongoing portuguese topic because this is about a broader issue, not a criticism of well-intentioned folks who are attempting to offer help/advice.
The persistence mechanism of other distros that offer liveboot persistence probably is not ill-affected by a read-only boot partition. Mint, Ubuntu, Debian… they employ a separate (writable) partition into which the persisted files are written. People onboarding from those other distros probably cannot fathom why “read-only or not” matters when creating a liveboot antiX pendrive. Apparently even some longtime antiX users ~~ folks who typically do not liveboot, just view the live media as a momentary bridge toward getting an O/S installed-to-disk on a new machine ~~ apparently they fail to consider the significance of this detail.
@rokytnji the wording in the OP intended to acknowkedge that PLoP does indeed have a special place (may be “your friend” in certain circumstances)… but, as you have repeatedly mentioned across the years (here, mx forum, linuxquestions forum) PLoP is sloooooow ~~ “it is like waiting for paint to dry”.
rokytnji
have repeatedly mentioned across the years (here, mx forum, linuxquestions forum) PLoP is sloooooow ~~ “it is like waiting for paint to dry”.
Sorry. Myt usb 1.1 frustrations show :). Pmcia usb 2.0 has worked better from time to time.
But newer cd of plop is needed for pcmcia boot.Sometimes I drive a crooked road to get my mind straight.
Not all who Wander are Lost.
I'm not outa place. I'm from outer space.Linux Registered User # 475019
How to Search for AntiX solutions to your problemsmarcelocripe
@christophe,
I thank you for clarifying the acronyms. According to mr. Brian mentioned a few times, we have difficulties with the acronyms, because we are unable to understand the translations of the internet translators.
@skidoo,
Placed this topic in Kafeino instead of nosing into the ongoing portuguese topic because it’s about a broader issue, not a criticism of well-intentioned folks who are attempting to offer help/advice.
I understood perfectly what you meant, I was able to understand in translation your good intention, which I am grateful to you.
What I can do is to supplement this information in the topic https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/como-criar-pendrive-inicializavel-usando-o-ventoy-2/. But I can’t confuse people with advanced information on a topic that aims to exemplify a process that needs to be simple and easy for anyone to be able to have their first contact with antiX. Even if it is not possible to use persistence, because the programs available for Windows do not have the same quality and usage potential as Live USB Maker does. I still have a lot to learn, including using Live USB Maker.
The PLoP you mentioned, is it the program on this site https://www.plop.at/en/ploplinux/index.html?
I wonder how it would be possible to prepare a bootable flash drive without having an antiX.
Does it work? (I have no way to test this process today, I would need to have another pendrive available)
1 Prepare the first bootable USB stick with a program that works on Windows and that works on computer startup.
2 Boot the computer with the first bootable flash drive.
3 After antiX starts, connect the second USB stick to be prepared with Live USB Maker.
4 Open the Live USB Maker program, select the second flash drive, locate the antiX ISO that was downloaded in Windows to prepare the second flash bootable with antiX.
5 Select “Full Mode – Recordable LiveUSB”This process seems to be very complicated for those who are leaving Windows and are arriving in antiX, especially for those who arrived here due to the possibility of having persistence through the bootable USB stick with antiX.
The truth is that antiX offers a huge range of possibilities for use and that is fantastic!
I thank everyone for their guidance and clarification.
marcelocripe
(Original text in Brazilian Portuguese)———-
@christophe,
Eu agradeço por esclarecer as sigla. Conforme o sr. Brian citou algumas vezes, temos dificuldades com as siglas, pois não conseguimos compreender nas traduções dos tradutores da internet.
@skidoo,
Placed this topic in Kafeino instead of nosing into the ongoing portuguese topic because it’s about a broader issue, not a criticism of well-intentioned folks who are attempting to offer help/advice.
Eu entendi perfeitamente o que você quis dizer, eu consegui compreender na tradução a sua boa intenção, a qual eu sou grato a você.
O que eu posso fazer é complementar esta informação no tópico https://www.antixforum.com/forums/topic/como-criar-pendrive-inicializavel-usando-o-ventoy-2/. Mas eu não posso confundir as pessoas com informações avançadas em um tópico que tem o objetivo de exemplificar um processo que precisa ser simples e fácil para qualquer um conseguir ter o primeiro contato com o antiX. Mesmo que seja sem a possibilidade de utilizar a persistência, devido os programas disponíveis para o Windows não possuírem a mesma qualidade e potencial de utilização que o Live USB Maker possui. Eu ainda tenho muito o que aprender, inclusive em utilizar o Live USB Maker.
O PLoP que você citou, por acaso é o programa deste site https://www.plop.at/en/ploplinux/index.html?
Eu fico imaginando como seria possível para preparar um pendrive inicializável sem ter um antiX.
Será que isso funciona? (Eu não tenho como testar hoje este processo, eu precisaria ter outro pendrive disponível)
1 Preparar o primeiro pendrive inicializável com um programa que funcione no Windows e que funcione na inicialização do computador.
2 Inicializar o computador com o primeiro pendrive inicializável.
3 Após o antiX inicializar, conecta-se o segundo pendrive para ser preparado com o Live USB Maker.
4 Abrir o programa Live USB Maker, selecionar o segundo pendrive, localizar a ISO do antiX que foi transferida no Windows para preparar o segundo pendrive inicializável com o antiX.
5 Selecionar o “Modo completo – LiveUSB gravável”Este processo parece ser bem complicado para quem está saindo do Windows e está chegando no antiX, em especial para quem chegou aqui devido a possibilidade de ter a persistência através do pendrive inicializável com o antiX.
A bem da verdade é que o antiX oferece uma gama gigantesca de possibilidades de utilização e isso é fantástico!
Eu agradeço a todos pelas orientações e esclarecimentos.
marcelocripe
(Texto original em Português do Brasil)If onboarding from another linux distribution, live-usb-maker is THE ideal utility to use.
Greatly appreciated. I was not aware LUM is available outside of antiX/MX as appimage to run on other Linux distros.
So in my understanding LUM would use an antiX distribution ISO as input and create an antiX Live USB instance.So, taking from this, as LUM has another input option to use ‘From Running System’ instead of ISO image, would this create a Live USB of the Linux system on which it is being executed?
I will be glad to test and confirm this but I think reaching out to our experts skidoo and possibly BitJam if still available would be more viable path to officially confirm…
Any reply will be greatly appreciated…
Regards.Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):
https://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/Table_of_antiX_Boot_Parameterssticky-ing a topic for this seems like a “too little, too late” approach, IMO
.This page links to a video which instructs the use of live-usb-maker
https://antixlinux.com/the-most-extensive-live-usb-on-the-planet/
but reader may wonder whether it is still accurate (link hypertext mentions “antiX17”)
and the page does not provide onboarding instructions for WinOS usersThe antixlinux.com “Download” page provides zero onboarding info
https://antixlinux.com/download/https://sourceforge.net/projects/antix-linux/
nor here https://sourceforge.net/projects/antix-linux/files/onboarding has not been covered in the FAQ doc
http://download.tuxfamily.org/antix/docs-antiX-19/FAQ/index.html#_pre_installationhttps://antixlinuxfan.miraheze.org/wiki/How_to_install#Creating_the_bootable_USB
A wiki page claims
“you need a software called “USBMaker-git” (sic). It is available on most Linux distributions, in the package installer…”
Dave
Does this fit the bill?
https://antixlinux.com/download/Feel free to comment on inaccuracies.
It is quite a wordy chunk…Computers are like air conditioners. They work fine until you start opening Windows. ~Author Unknown
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