testing 5.10 kernel

Forum Forums antiX-development Development testing 5.10 kernel

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    Brian Masinick

      I am very sorry to report that our new 5.10.142 (2nd version), which I downloaded onto my Dell Inspiron 5558 laptop after successfully testing it on my Acer Aspire 5 Model A515-55, DOES NOT match the results; the Dell won’t load the kernel, it sticks at navigating /dev, searching for devices.

      The 4.9 kernel and the Liquorix kernels work fine, but NONE of the 5.10 kernels work – not the first 5.10.142 nor the second update to 142, nor the 137 or 104 versions either.

      Here’s my pinxi output on a working kernel:

      pinxi -Fxz
        Kernel: 5.19.0-8.2-liquorix-amd64 arch: x86_64 bits: 64 compiler: gcc
          v: 10.2.1 Desktop: IceWM v: 2.9.9 Distro: antiX-21-runit_x64-base Grup
          Yorum 30 October 2021 base: Debian GNU/Linux 11 (bullseye)
        Type: Laptop System: Dell product: Inspiron 5558 v: 01
          serial: <superuser required>
        Mobo: Dell model: 086DKN v: A00 serial: <superuser required> UEFI: Dell
          v: A04 date: 08/06/2015
        ID-1: BAT0 charge: 24.3 Wh (80.7%) condition: 30.1/41.4 Wh (72.6%)
          volts: 16.5 min: 14.8 model: Samsung SDI DELL 07G07587587 status: charging
        Info: dual core model: Intel Core i7-5500U bits: 64 type: MT MCP
          arch: Broadwell rev: 4 cache: L1: 128 KiB L2: 512 KiB L3: 4 MiB
        Speed (MHz): avg: 2398 high: 2401 min/max: 500/2401 boost: enabled cores:
          1: 2395 2: 2395 3: 2401 4: 2401 bogomips: 19154
        Flags: avx avx2 ht lm nx pae sse sse2 sse3 sse4_1 sse4_2 ssse3 vmx
        Device-1: Intel HD Graphics 5500 vendor: Dell driver: i915 v: kernel
          arch: Gen-8 bus-ID: 00:02.0
        Device-2: NVIDIA GK208BM [GeForce 920M] vendor: Dell driver: N/A
          arch: Kepler bus-ID: 08:00.0
        Device-3: Suyin Integrated_Webcam_HD type: USB driver: uvcvideo
          bus-ID: 2-5:3
        Display: x11 server: X.Org v: 1.20.11 driver: X: loaded: modesetting
          unloaded: fbdev,vesa dri: iris gpu: i915 resolution: 1366x768~60Hz
        OpenGL: renderer: Mesa Intel HD Graphics 5500 (BDW GT2) v: 4.6 Mesa
          20.3.5 direct render: Yes
        Device-1: Intel Broadwell-U Audio vendor: Dell driver: snd_hda_intel
          v: kernel bus-ID: 00:03.0
        Device-2: Intel Wildcat Point-LP High Definition Audio vendor: Dell
          driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel bus-ID: 00:1b.0
        Device-3: NVIDIA GK208 HDMI/DP Audio driver: snd_hda_intel v: kernel
          bus-ID: 08:00.1
        Sound Interface: ALSA v: k5.19.0-8.2-liquorix-amd64 running: yes
        Device-1: Intel Wireless 3160 driver: iwlwifi v: kernel bus-ID: 06:00.0
        IF: wlan0 state: up mac: <filter>
        Device-2: Realtek RTL810xE PCI Express Fast Ethernet vendor: Dell
          driver: r8169 v: kernel port: e000 bus-ID: 07:00.0
        IF: eth0 state: down mac: <filter>
        Device-1: Intel Bluetooth wireless interface type: USB driver: btusb v: 0.8
          bus-ID: 2-6:4
        Report: rfkill ID: hci0 rfk-id: 0 state: down bt-service: not found
          rfk-block: hardware: no software: yes address: see --recommends
        Local Storage: total: 447.13 GiB used: 32.32 GiB (7.2%)
        ID-1: /dev/sda vendor: Kingston model: SA400S37480G size: 447.13 GiB
        ID-1: / size: 78.19 GiB used: 32.31 GiB (41.3%) fs: ext4 dev: /dev/sda6
        ID-2: /boot/efi size: 98.4 MiB used: 2.2 MiB (2.3%) fs: vfat
          dev: /dev/sda1
        ID-1: swap-1 type: partition size: 8 GiB used: 0 KiB (0.0%) dev: /dev/sda2
        System Temperatures: cpu: 51.0 C mobo: N/A sodimm: SODIMM C
        Fan Speeds (RPM): cpu: 1500
        Processes: 165 Uptime: 2m Memory: 7.68 GiB used: 469.8 MiB (6.0%)
        Init: runit runlevel: 2 Compilers: gcc: 10.2.1 Packages: 1308 Shell: Bash
        v: 5.1.4 pinxi: 3.3.21-15

      Brian Masinick

      Brian Masinick

        I wonder if I have some microcode that needs to be updated here?

        I’ll look into it and see if that resolves my issue on this system. Strangely, only the 5.10 kernel is affected on the Dell, nothing else.
        Also, the 5.10 kernel WAS working on MX Linux; go figure!

        Brian Masinick

        Forum Admin


          Does the very latest 5.10 Debian kernel work with antiX?
          That is what MX uses.

          Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

          antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

          Brian Masinick

            The very latest 5.10.142, rev. 2 kernel WORKS with the Acer Aspire 5 Model A515-55, it flatly DOES NOT work at all with the Dell Inspiron 5558 laptop, nor do ANY of the 5.10 kernels I’ve recently tried there.

            I may, however, have stumbled on a potential cause, which I’m beginning to research:
            The Dell Inspiron 5558 may be in need of a firmware update, which exposes an issue in the 5.10 kernel series, and may affect properly loading /dev – that’s where it hangs.

            IF I find anything definitive, I will look for firmware fixes, retest and see if that solves the issue.

            I’ll certainly let you know ASAP.

            Brian Masinick

            Brian Masinick

              One topic I wanted to look into is http://dev1galaxy.org/viewtopic.php?id=3185 – I’m not sure that’s it, but I can try it on the Dell.

              I’ll also try the latest Debian 5.10 kernel, but I’m pretty sure that one was failing too.

              Brian Masinick

              Brian Masinick

                What I still don’t understand is why it’s only the Dell acting up; that’s why I’m inclined to check into the firmware.

                Meanwhile, here’s something else to consider:
                http://forums.debian.net/viewtopic.php?t=96090 – one guy was able to resolve issues by adding a nomodeset on the boot linux line.
                I’ll look into that on the Dell too.

                Brian Masinick


                  I am very curious what you will find out as the cause of the problem…
                  I read yesterday somewhere that similar behavior was resolved by identifying device causing the problem and downloading microcode update. In that case it was nVidia card.
                  I see that your computer has both Intel and nVidia graphics…
                  I am not jumping to conclusion but perhaps this might be something to look at, as behavior described is similar.
                  Even so it remains to understand why all 5.10 kernels are affected. I do not remember whether you mentioned trying kernel later than 5.10, such as 5.18. This would not resolve the issue but perhaps just to narrow down kernel version behavior as just 5.10 and not ‘5.10 and later’…
                  Good luck in your research.

                  I just retested 5.10.142 on my Thinkpad T520 – i7, which also has Intel and nVidia (NVS 4200M). It boots fine on mine as previously reported.

                  • This reply was modified 1 year, 7 months ago by olsztyn.

                  Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):


                    Beware, Brian’s PC uses two graphics drivers, one of which is the famous i915.

                    I use kernel 5.18 which is fully compatible with my Intel CPU with the i915 graphics driver.

                    The new 5.10.142 kernel also works for me but I think other PCs will still have problems with this 5.10 kernel.

                    It would also be a pity if Debian forces to update the firmware because it would mean that old PCs won’t have the chance to work with newer kernels anymore since there are no more firmware updates.

                    Dear Brian, I really hope you will find a solution.

                    Best regards,

                    Forum Admin

                      My trusty lenovo L412 has not had any problems with any antiX or Debian 5.10 kernel.
                      It also uses the i915 driver

                      inxi -G
                        Device-1: Intel Core Processor Integrated Graphics driver: i915 v: kernel
                        Device-2: Lenovo Integrated Webcam [R5U877] type: USB driver: uvcvideo
                        Display: server: X.Org v: 1.20.11 with: Xwayland driver: X: loaded: intel
                          gpu: i915 resolution: 1366x768~60Hz
                        OpenGL: renderer: Mesa DRI Intel HD Graphics (ILK) v: 2.1 Mesa 20.3.5

                      Philosophers have interpreted the world in many ways; the point is to change it.

                      antiX with runit - leaner and meaner.

                      Brian Masinick

                        I’m not sure that i915 has anything to do with the problem, at least not ONLY i915; my Acer has i915 and it works with any recent kernel; the Acer Aspire 5 won’t work on 4.9 kernels because the hardware is newer.

                        The Dell Inspiron laptop is 2015-16 vintage; I still suspect firmware as the culprit but I have not completed my work.

                        I did alter the boot loader GRUB settings to nomodeset and got a lot more output; I’m hoping to find something useful in /var/log.

                        I’m ill this week so I am limited in what I can check and how long I can study logfiles but I won’t give up on this; I still think it’s my system that has out of date firmware and the few of us with the remaining problem are likely facing similar issues; right now that is conjecture; I intend to prove or refute it; meanwhile the 5.18 kernel works fine.

                        Brian Masinick


                          I intend to prove or refute it; meanwhile the 5.18 kernel works fine.

                          Thank you Brian for doing all this testing work in spite of being sick. Please do not do it at the expense of your recovery though…
                          Your Dell appears to be one of very few machines reported to not boot with kernel 5.10 line. Your quoted above report tell me that kernel 5.18 works fine, so the issue is specific to 5.10 line in general and not ‘kernel 5.10 and later’. This my statement is not precise, more of a broad generalization…
                          Although it is very interesting to identify what exactly is causing the problem, sometimes it is not worth the exorbitant work to prove, particularly not at the expense of your recovery. This problem has been reported as affecting just three (so far) machines after all…
                          Just unrelated (I think) question: Are you running antiX with Sysvinit or Runit? I do not suppose this has any bearing on booting ability so just a wild question…

                          • This reply was modified 1 year, 7 months ago by olsztyn.

                          Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):

                          Brian Masinick

                            For what it’s worth, I decided to go to a “single boot” setup on my Acer Aspire 5 Model A515-55.

                            I’ve had to reinstall, fix, recreate, etc. over and over on that system recently.
                            Prior to a few weeks ago, it was stable and clean.

                            I got tired of it, so now I have the entire disk and the entire system devoted to antiX!

                            When I feel better, I’ll figure out what’s going on with the Dell, but this is actually my main system; it’s so much faster than the others it’s not funny!
                            All of my other systems have antiX on them too.

                            Brian Masinick


                              You have much longer experience with antiX than I have. I like antiX to be my primary system. On all my laptops, running in the Live form, whether starting from USB or from the internal SATA.
                              My argument for antiX:
                              – Fast – because of the only code executing is what is essential for OS and apps to run. No wasted resources for useless and incompetent DEs.
                              – Minimal memory footprint contributes to being fast and loading fast. No wasted memory to slow down execution of apps.
                              – Generated heat is minimal so CPU fan operation can be minimal.

                              Now, going back to testing kernel 5.10 topic as required by this thread:

                              – There have been only three cases reported of hardware where kernel 5.10 line has trouble to boot – your Dell, the one reported by mikey777 and blur13. It would be interesting to find out why but it may not be worth extensive effort, considering later kernels, such as 5.18 typically work fine. So it is not that support has been dropped for those machines. Rather it is something unique about kernel 5.10 line.
                              – In spite of sporadic issues with kernel 5.10 line I think that anticapitalista’s decision to standardize on kernel 5.10 as the ‘modern’ kernel option for antiX 21 and antiX 22 is the best one under circumstances.
                              Particularly it seems the best balance of being ‘modern’ and efficiency such as memory footprint. Kernel 5.10 line has better memory footprint than later ones and my expectation it is faster.
                              Particularly (in my testing) kernel 5.10.142, which appears to have the smallest memory footprint and best memory management. Calciumsodium did not see any memory footprint gains running sysvinit but with my systems as runit I definitely see better memory footprint vs. 5.10.104 by about 10Mb. I am very particular about memory footprint and it is noticeable. Perhaps some optimizations have taken place…

                              All in all, to me antiX 21 runit *elogind*-free with kernel 5.10.142 (this OS composition is a.k.a antiX 22) is pure beauty. Highly optimized, fully capable Linux without redundant baggage to slow it down or restrict capacity. Although anticapitalista might decide that equivalent sysvinit version of antiX is to be considered as antiX 22 as well…

                              • This reply was modified 1 year, 7 months ago by olsztyn.

                              Live antiX Boot Options (Previously posted by Xecure):

                              Brian Masinick

                                I agree that the likelihood of the issues being specific to the 2-3 systems is high; when I was able to get multiple 5.10 kernels working on the Acer Aspire 5 I was encouraged; it turned out that the only reason that the Aspire couldn’t run wireless at first is because the USB I burned boots by default to a 4.9 kernel; it DOES boot on the Aspire but it only has Bluetooth and Ethernet networks recognized; when I boot the 5.10 kernel it seems everything.

                                This helps me out as far as figuring out what is missing on the Dell;
                                I found some log files; I’ll run 1-2 more ‘bad boots’ and then login with a working kernel once I feel better.

                                Brian Masinick

                                Brian Masinick

                                  I have TWO working 5.10 kernels on my Acer Aspire 5 so having MULTIPLE instances of V5.10 kernels has no bearing on any issues.

                                  I’m still leaning toward firmware and/or questionable hardware configurations impacting those with 5.10 kernel problems, including the ones I have seen.
                                  I don’t blame it on our kernels; they obviously work in the majority of cases.

                                  When I’m back to full strength I’ll do an in depth analysis of my Dell Inspiron 5558 and the 5.10 kernels there.

                                  Brian Masinick

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